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RGL 6s league
61
#61
10 Frags +
tua
Want to know the difference between the r8 being banned by CSGO tournaments and the 6s whitelist? CSGO tournaments use almost exactly the same rules and shit as Valve matchmaking.

yeah thats literally the only difference between dev support and community interaction between tf2 and cs

[quote=tua]

Want to know the difference between the r8 being banned by CSGO tournaments and the 6s whitelist? CSGO tournaments use almost exactly the same rules and shit as Valve matchmaking.[/quote]


yeah thats literally the only difference between dev support and community interaction between tf2 and cs
62
#62
22 Frags +
sigafooI'm ready for the 2 heavies, 2 engies, 2 medics final defense, only to lose to six invis spies decloaking on the final point.

That doesn't sound like fun at all.

[quote=sigafoo]I'm ready for the 2 heavies, 2 engies, 2 medics final defense, only to lose to six invis spies decloaking on the final point.[/quote]
That doesn't sound like fun at all.
63
#63
8 Frags +

nursey blaze med
yomps arekk scout
b4nny habib demo

please i must see this

nursey blaze med
yomps arekk scout
b4nny habib demo

please i must see this
64
#64
8 Frags +

i mean
it seems like sigafoo is gonna run this league whether valve ends up giving a shit or not
i say play the league, go after your free check, and then he sends his data to valve
worst case scenario you wasted 30 minutes, once a week, for like 2 months maybe

i mean
it seems like sigafoo is gonna run this league whether valve ends up giving a shit or not
i say play the league, go after your free check, and then he sends his data to valve
worst case scenario you wasted 30 minutes, once a week, for like 2 months maybe
65
#65
10 Frags +

LFP

6 Engineers, we already have 3

LFP

6 Engineers, we already have 3
66
#66
14 Frags +
Nursayevery comp player that has visited valve has always came back saying we need to run no class limits and no whitelist

do whatever u want with this information....

elaborate on what it'll do for us?
I personally can with confidence say I like the current 6s meta and the lobbies where our pocket manages to go demo (2 scouts, 1 solly, 2 demos, 1 med) have only been aids, will no rules give us support, a more fun comp game or a more aids inclusive (ironically people would be shit on more by demos and scouts making it more exclusive than anything) meta?
you've failed to elaborate on what the gain is before, both you and b4nny have evaded the question what you were promised in return for compromising our current 6s ruleset and meta

tua

Valve also just copypasted what the community had decided should be rules for competitive play back in cs 1.6 and css
TF2 has over 100 unique weapons, most cs weapons have been more or less the same over the 19 years of the game's existence, csgo has had a whitelist in comp (which was also used in mm) where the zeus, negev and r8 have been banned, the mp5 was also banned in comp until they managed to be able to safely say that the weapon wasn't broken, much like what global whitelist has been doing, the CSGO devs work with pro players which is how the map pool has been selected and TF2 devs have been doing the exact opposite

[quote=Nursay]every comp player that has visited valve has always came back saying we need to run no class limits and no whitelist

do whatever u want with this information....[/quote]
elaborate on what it'll do for us?
I personally can with confidence say I like the current 6s meta and the lobbies where our pocket manages to go demo (2 scouts, 1 solly, 2 demos, 1 med) have only been aids, will no rules give us support, a more fun comp game or a more [s]aids[/s] inclusive (ironically people would be shit on more by demos and scouts making it more exclusive than anything) meta?
you've failed to elaborate on what the gain is before, both you and b4nny have evaded the question what you were promised in return for compromising our current 6s ruleset and meta
[quote=tua][/quote]
Valve also just copypasted what the community had decided should be rules for competitive play back in cs 1.6 and css
TF2 has over 100 unique weapons, most cs weapons have been more or less the same over the 19 years of the game's existence, csgo has had a whitelist in comp (which was also used in mm) where the zeus, negev and r8 have been banned, the mp5 was also banned in comp until they managed to be able to safely say that the weapon wasn't broken, much like what global whitelist has been doing, the CSGO devs work with pro players which is how the map pool has been selected and TF2 devs have been doing the exact opposite
67
#67
1 Frags +

it reminds me of that tvtv showmatch we did years ago, fun times. LFT, obviously.

edit :

rulesPlayers outside of NA can play, assuming they have reasonable ping. No more than 2 players from outside NA can be playing for a team.

A bit harsh isnt it? After all, if us euros want to play, we're already at a disadvantage due to ping, so why restrict us?

it reminds me of that tvtv showmatch we did years ago, fun times. LFT, obviously.

edit :
[quote=rules]Players outside of NA can play, assuming they have reasonable ping. No more than 2 players from outside NA can be playing for a team.[/quote]
A bit harsh isnt it? After all, if us euros want to play, we're already at a disadvantage due to ping, so why restrict us?
68
#68
-4 Frags +

finally i can play proper pyro in 6's

finally i can play proper pyro in 6's
69
#69
18 Frags +

I wonder what the excuse is gonna be when this turns out to be completely unplayable as a competitive format

I wonder what the excuse is gonna be when this turns out to be completely unplayable as a competitive format
70
#70
35 Frags +
GazI wonder what the excuse is gonna be when this turns out to be completely unplayable as a competitive format

6s players are too stupid to counter the 4 demoman defence

[quote=Gaz]I wonder what the excuse is gonna be when this turns out to be completely unplayable as a competitive format[/quote]
6s players are too stupid to counter the 4 demoman defence
71
#71
3 Frags +
Olghafinally i can play proper pyro in 6's

as much as I want to see this you're probably gonna run into hordes of heavies
hell it might be more viable to play pyro in normal regulation 6s

[quote=Olgha]finally i can play proper pyro in 6's[/quote]

as much as I want to see this you're probably gonna run into hordes of heavies
hell it might be more viable to play pyro in normal regulation 6s
72
#72
-21 Frags +
hamahamNursayevery comp player that has visited valve has always came back saying we need to run no class limits and no whitelist

do whatever u want with this information....
elaborate on what it'll do for us?
I personally can with confidence say I like the current 6s meta and the lobbies where our pocket manages to go demo (2 scouts, 1 solly, 2 demos, 1 med) have only been aids, will no rules give us support, a more fun comp game or a more aids inclusive (ironically people would be shit on more by demos and scouts making it more exclusive than anything) meta?
you've failed to elaborate on what the gain is before, both you and b4nny have evaded the question what you were promised in return for compromising our current 6s ruleset and meta

No one's evaded any question, the answer to this question has been given in the front page news article as well as in our reddit post and probably in this thread as well.

Again, I'll state this. This league is not to prove that MM is the greatest thing in the world and we've all been missing out. The goal isn't to prove that no class restrictions will help class diversity, I agree with you. I'm guessing it'll get worst.

The goal is very clearly stated directly in the article on the front page is to gain information from this league that we can give to Valve as well as the Comp Community and hopefully both can try to get closer to a unification point. As we'll have evidence from every level of comp tf2 skill sets to show why this format does or does not work. Or what aspect of it works or does not work.

Payload has been very effective in Prolander and seems to work well in MM. Can this tournament help show us if it works when you have two proper teams? Or most teams strongly dislike it?

Sixes still has a large whitelist compared to other leagues, can this league help show that at least /some/ of those weapons could be unbanned? Or will this clearly back the players who are holding the line in the global whitelist talks?

Does having no class restrictions allow class diversity to happen? Or does it make class diversity worst due to the balance of the classes?

etc...

Many people have theory crafted about these ideas, but we've never really truly investigated this. Sure there's been those half-hearted events where two teams play a couple maps with nothing on the line, but that never really seemed to prove much. Now with this cup, we will have multiple weeks of data, from every skill level and detailed survey feedback from all of these levels.

Valve has shown themselves to work with the comp community through adding a comp matchmaking into the game. Changing the system to have placement matches and most importantly balancing weapons seemingly with the focus of Comp in mind. They've made strides to help out the comp community, but we as a community haven't done anything but dismiss them.

Again, this isn't to say what they're doing is right, but regardless of whether or not this format is successful. We will come away from this situation with something positive.

[quote=hamaham][quote=Nursay]every comp player that has visited valve has always came back saying we need to run no class limits and no whitelist

do whatever u want with this information....[/quote]
elaborate on what it'll do for us?
I personally can with confidence say I like the current 6s meta and the lobbies where our pocket manages to go demo (2 scouts, 1 solly, 2 demos, 1 med) have only been aids, will no rules give us support, a more fun comp game or a more [s]aids[/s] inclusive (ironically people would be shit on more by demos and scouts making it more exclusive than anything) meta?
you've failed to elaborate on what the gain is before, both you and b4nny have evaded the question what you were promised in return for compromising our current 6s ruleset and meta[/quote]

No one's evaded any question, the answer to this question has been given in the front page news article as well as in our reddit post and probably in this thread as well.

Again, I'll state this. This league is not to prove that MM is the greatest thing in the world and we've all been missing out. The goal isn't to prove that no class restrictions will help class diversity, I agree with you. I'm guessing it'll get worst.

The goal is very clearly stated directly in the article on the front page is to gain information from this league that we can give to Valve as well as the Comp Community and hopefully both can try to get closer to a unification point. As we'll have evidence from every level of comp tf2 skill sets to show why this format does or does not work. Or what aspect of it works or does not work.


Payload has been very effective in Prolander and seems to work well in MM. Can this tournament help show us if it works when you have two proper teams? Or most teams strongly dislike it?

Sixes still has a large whitelist compared to other leagues, can this league help show that at least /some/ of those weapons could be unbanned? Or will this clearly back the players who are holding the line in the global whitelist talks?

Does having no class restrictions allow class diversity to happen? Or does it make class diversity worst due to the balance of the classes?

etc...

Many people have theory crafted about these ideas, but we've never really truly investigated this. Sure there's been those half-hearted events where two teams play a couple maps with nothing on the line, but that never really seemed to prove much. Now with this cup, we will have multiple weeks of data, from every skill level and detailed survey feedback from all of these levels.

Valve has shown themselves to work with the comp community through adding a comp matchmaking into the game. Changing the system to have placement matches and most importantly balancing weapons seemingly with the focus of Comp in mind. They've made strides to help out the comp community, but we as a community haven't done anything but dismiss them.

Again, this isn't to say what they're doing is right, but regardless of whether or not this format is successful. We will come away from this situation with something positive.
73
#73
37 Frags +
sigafooValve has shown themselves to work with the comp community through adding a comp matchmaking into the game. Changing the system to have placement matches and most importantly balancing weapons seemingly with the focus of Comp in mind. They've made strides to help out the comp community, but we as a community haven't done anything but dismiss them.

Not sure about you, but a 3 YEAR turnaround time isn't what I would call "working with", and to try and pass of the blame to the community rather than valve is an absolute fucking joke. Stop riding valves dick so hard holy shit.

[quote=sigafoo]
Valve has shown themselves to work with the comp community through adding a comp matchmaking into the game. Changing the system to have placement matches and most importantly balancing weapons seemingly with the focus of Comp in mind. They've made strides to help out the comp community, but we as a community haven't done anything but dismiss them.
[/quote]

Not sure about you, but a 3 [b]YEAR[/b] turnaround time isn't what I would call "working with", and to try and pass of the blame to the community rather than valve is an absolute fucking joke. Stop riding valves dick so hard holy shit.
74
#74
12 Frags +

no classlimits and all that pretty sure we have been there about 11 years ago or so and already realised how awful it is but surely this time it will be a whole different story

might aswell bring back random crits and fund maps like 2fort or ctf_well they were loved in the comp scene aswell

no classlimits and all that pretty sure we have been there about 11 years ago or so and already realised how awful it is but surely this time it will be a whole different story

might aswell bring back random crits and fund maps like 2fort or ctf_well they were loved in the comp scene aswell
75
#75
9 Frags +

sigafoo you magnificent bastard

Unfortunately the only data you can get that might interest the almighty Valve would be 6 figure stream viewers. Anyone want to chip into a viewbot fund?

sigafoo you magnificent bastard

Unfortunately the only data you can get that might interest the almighty Valve would be 6 figure stream viewers. Anyone want to chip into a viewbot fund?
76
#76
ETF2L
60 Frags +

Personally, I cannot approve this blatant attempt to help the comptetitive TF2 community to get closer to a unification point with Valve with the undeniable intention to pave the way for TF2 to become an E-Sport.

Our ETF2L staff has, for years, been devoted to finally put an end to Team Fortress 2; especially the gamemode that is commonly known as "Highlander". Ever since our overlord and saviour Permzilla - may he find peace in his exile - (happy birthday) joined the admin ranks on a warm spring friday on 25th may 2012, it has been our mission to follow him in his quest to kill comp TF2. In these almost 7 years we have put countless hours of hard work into sabotaging the league and thus the community from the inside. I mean: we added ctf_turbine in Season 18, we played koth_reservoir in the Highlander Prem Grand Finals (god bless KkaltuU, possibly the best soldier we ever had)... But people would still sign up and enjoy the games. >.<
That's when we decided to cancel our sponsorship-deal with Tte-SPORTS, hoping the top talent would simply lose interest in competing. Sure, as of late our attempts have become more desperate and obvious, like the promotion of not one, but two weebs to Head Admins or simply rigging public polls in order to kill the best map to ever have lived: cp_badlands (press f)... But we still truly believe that we eventually - through more "progressive" mapchoices and especially through the absolutely random bans we are dishing out - will succeed and earn our place at the holy table of our predecessors Permzilla and SonnyBlack.
How dare you hazard this Greater Good after all that we have accomplished. We are soooo close, and here you stand, suggesting individual freedom, creativity and - worst of all- change, sigafoo?

Shame on you. SHAME... ON... YOU!11!1!!

Personally, I [i]cannot[/i] approve this blatant attempt to help the comptetitive TF2 community to get closer to a unification point with Valve with the undeniable intention to pave the way for TF2 to become an E-Sport.

Our ETF2L staff has, for years, been devoted to finally put an end to Team Fortress 2; especially the gamemode that is commonly known as "Highlander". Ever since our overlord and saviour [b]Permzilla[/b] - may he find peace in his exile - (happy birthday) joined the admin ranks on a warm spring friday on [b]25th may 2012[/b], it has been our mission to follow him in his quest to kill comp TF2. In these almost [b]7 years[/b] we have put countless hours of hard work into sabotaging the league and thus the community from the inside. I mean: we added [b]ctf_turbine[/b] in Season 18, we played [b]koth_reservoir[/b] in the Highlander Prem Grand Finals (god bless [u]KkaltuU[/u], possibly the best soldier we [b]ever[/b] had)... But people would still sign up and enjoy the games. >.<
That's when we decided to cancel our sponsorship-deal with Tte-SPORTS, hoping the top talent would simply lose interest in competing. Sure, as of late our attempts have become more desperate and obvious, like the promotion of not one, but [b]two weebs[/b] to Head Admins or simply rigging public polls in order to kill the best map to ever have lived: cp_badlands ([i]press f[/i])... But we still truly believe that we eventually - through more "progressive" mapchoices and especially through the absolutely random bans we are dishing out - will succeed and earn our place at the holy table of our predecessors Permzilla and SonnyBlack.
How dare you hazard this Greater Good after all that we have accomplished. We are soooo close, and here you stand, suggesting individual [b]freedom[/b], [i]creativity[/i] and - worst of all- [u]change[/u], sigafoo?

Shame on you. SHAME... ON... YOU!11!1!!
77
#77
2 Frags +

at least it's not 7v7

at least it's not 7v7
78
#78
-2 Frags +

Does anyone know whether this league going to run any community made/edited maps or is it going to be stock maps only?

Show Content
also lft for the bad players' division
Does anyone know whether this league going to run any community made/edited maps or is it going to be stock maps only?

[spoiler]also lft for the bad players' division[/spoiler]
79
#79
4 Frags +

lft demo, prefer the flank. I can also play Natasha heavy very skillfully

lft demo, prefer the flank. I can also play Natasha heavy very skillfully
80
#80
18 Frags +
sigafooNo one's evaded any question, the answer to this question has been given in the front page news article as well as in our reddit post and probably in this thread as well.

When the bonk was getting unbanned they evaded a fuck ton of questions both on twitter and on here

sigafooValve has shown themselves to work with the comp community through adding a comp matchmaking into the game. Changing the system to have placement matches and most importantly balancing weapons seemingly with the focus of Comp in mind.

comp matchmaking was to sorta combat overwatch release wasn't it? it was pretty much the opposite of what people wanted too since they forced some real goofy settings like dx9 despite game running like dogshite for like 50% of the playerbase

sigafooThey've made strides to help out the comp community, but we as a community haven't done anything but dismiss them.

Yeah like giving them a ton of feedback only to have it disregarded because reddit said "we want this :D"

[quote=sigafoo]
No one's evaded any question, the answer to this question has been given in the front page news article as well as in our reddit post and probably in this thread as well.
[/quote]
When the bonk was getting unbanned they evaded a fuck ton of questions both on twitter and on here
[quote=sigafoo]
Valve has shown themselves to work with the comp community through adding a comp matchmaking into the game. Changing the system to have placement matches and most importantly balancing weapons seemingly with the focus of Comp in mind.
[/quote]
comp matchmaking was to sorta combat overwatch release wasn't it? it was pretty much the opposite of what people wanted too since they forced some real goofy settings like dx9 despite game running like dogshite for like 50% of the playerbase
[quote=sigafoo]
They've made strides to help out the comp community, but we as a community haven't done anything but dismiss them. [/quote]
Yeah like giving them a ton of feedback only to have it disregarded because reddit said "we want this :D"
81
#81
0 Frags +

What is the utility of saying "I don't /agree/understand/care/like this/...". Even when you have reasons supporting that statement like "I didn't like it before/it sounds bad to me/I feel not drawn to it/I don't agree with what might be the reasons for doing it/I don't like the tone of the message/...".

I'm really curious, nobody does anything that doesn't serve a purpose. So what purpose do these messages serve?
Is it an outlet for negative emotions that are tied to a series of unmet expectations?

I don't see it serving a purpose at the moment, I feel like if you don't feel drawn to something, just let it be and do something you are drawn to instead.

Not talking about the few bits that are constructive here, just all the bloat around it.

What is the utility of saying "I don't /agree/understand/care/like this/...". Even when you have reasons supporting that statement like "I didn't like it before/it sounds bad to me/I feel not drawn to it/I don't agree with what might be the reasons for doing it/I don't like the tone of the message/...".

I'm really curious, nobody does anything that doesn't serve a purpose. So what purpose do these messages serve?
Is it an outlet for negative emotions that are tied to a series of unmet expectations?

I don't see it serving a purpose at the moment, I feel like if you don't feel drawn to something, just let it be and do something you are drawn to instead.

Not talking about the few bits that are constructive here, just all the bloat around it.
82
#82
2 Frags +

cant wait to play some valve matchmaking

cant wait to play some valve matchmaking
83
#83
9 Frags +

I'm watching these no restrictions 6s pugs and they legitimately look like half empty pubs to me

I'm watching these no restrictions 6s pugs and they legitimately look like half empty pubs to me
84
#84
15 Frags +
sigafoo

Since you didn't answer it here, let me ask - Have you spoken to Valve (recently)? Do you know that they have any use for information like this? Have you asked how realistic it is to expect them to do anything with it? Do you know what plans they may have, or where their head is at? I believe it's naive to say you'll give them all this information and that it will lead to "something positive" if you don't actually know that for sure. I would want something more than "maybe" at this point. I think it's reasonable for others to also want to know this. Saying "sure they're interested, they gave us matchmaking right?" doesn't cut it.

[quote=sigafoo][/quote]

Since you didn't answer it here, let me ask - Have you spoken to Valve (recently)? Do you know that they have any use for information like this? Have you asked how realistic it is to expect them to do anything with it? Do you know what plans they may have, or where their head is at? I believe it's naive to say you'll give them all this information and that it will lead to "something positive" if you don't actually know that for sure. I would want something more than "maybe" at this point. I think it's reasonable for others to also want to know this. Saying "sure they're interested, they gave us matchmaking right?" doesn't cut it.
85
#85
-6 Frags +
Getawhalesigafoo
[...] Do you know that they [Valve] have any use for information like this? Have you asked how realistic it is to expect them to do anything with it?

Is it necessary to know that Valve is going to act on information gathered by playing this video game competitively and without restriction in order to do so? Can Valve (or anyone) predict that information they are going to get in the future are going to make them do X? Why is it necessary to expect anything? Isn't it exactly the act of establishing expectations that creates the foundation for disappointment? If you just do things you like doing in the present, missed expectations aren't going to ruin your day. Once you're done having fun, do something else.

Getawhalesigafoo [...] I believe it's naive to say you'll give them all this information and that it will lead to "something positive" if you don't actually know that for sure.

If you count being able to look back and say "yes we've tried that but it wasn't fun and the data only confirmed our assumptions" as superior to having to say "We aren't gonna play Matchmaking-style competitive TF2 because it's [unverified/unfalsified hypothesis]" then yes, even the worst case is a positive outcome.

Getawhalesigafoo [...] I would want something more than "maybe" at this point. I think it's reasonable for others to also want to know this. Saying "sure they're interested, they gave us matchmaking right?" doesn't cut it.

Seems like all you're saying is you're not interested and believe others aren't either. But of what relevance is this to people who are interested and want to try it? Of what importance is you or others not wanting play this to those who'd like to?

[quote=Getawhale][quote=sigafoo][/quote]

[...] Do you know that they [Valve] have any use for information like this? Have you asked how realistic it is to expect them to do anything with it?[/quote]

Is it necessary to know that Valve is going to act on information gathered by playing this video game competitively and without restriction in order to do so? Can Valve (or anyone) predict that information they are going to get in the future are going to make them do X? Why is it necessary to expect anything? Isn't it exactly the act of establishing expectations that creates the foundation for disappointment? If you just do things you like doing in the present, missed expectations aren't going to ruin your day. Once you're done having fun, do something else.

[quote=Getawhale][quote=sigafoo][/quote] [...] I believe it's naive to say you'll give them all this information and that it will lead to "something positive" if you don't actually know that for sure. [/quote]

If you count being able to look back and say "yes we've tried that but it wasn't fun and the data only confirmed our assumptions" as superior to having to say "We aren't gonna play Matchmaking-style competitive TF2 because it's [unverified/unfalsified hypothesis]" then yes, even the worst case is a positive outcome.

[quote=Getawhale][quote=sigafoo][/quote] [...] I would want something more than "maybe" at this point. I think it's reasonable for others to also want to know this. Saying "sure they're interested, they gave us matchmaking right?" doesn't cut it.[/quote]

Seems like all you're saying is you're not interested and believe others aren't either. But of what relevance is this to people who are interested and want to try it? Of what importance is you or others not wanting play this to those who'd like to?
86
#86
16 Frags +
Asec

No.

The league is fine, I encourage everyone to take part if they think it'll be fun. People enjoy the other RGL leagues - I've said this many times lately and mean it. My take on the league is irrelevant because I don't play.

A main selling point is literally that data will be sent to Valve. This is outlined very specifically on the website. And I see people coming out of the woodwork in this thread like "Well hey, it can't hurt."

My stance is very simple - sounds good but don't sell folks on Valve doing something with data if you're totally making that up and haven't spoken to Valve about it first. This is not a major piece of it, this doesn't hold up the league, it's not a crime etc, and sure you can do positive shit without Valve. But if folks are going to give their time and effort to this because they are being led to believe that Valve will get data, and that will somehow do something, I just hope they can find out NOW if it's not true or correct, rather than at season's end.

And sure, many people may not care about that! Maybe nobody cares, maybe everyone's happy to play whether or not anything will happen - I'm sure many will and that's cool. But with "improving competitive" and "the future of competitive" and all these buzzwords being thrown around.. I mean "Valve gets data and improves our game" is the ultimate pipe dream, and has been for 10 years, right? People will buy into this really fucking easily and quickly - it's close to our hearts. I think it's fair for players to want to know whether it's BS or not.

And absolutely, if nobody cares at all, then I'll shut up. But I think this is a fair thing to want details on. If the season is finished and we send over.. whatever data, I guess the survey details or whatever, and Valve says like "Uh we don't have enough people, we can't do anything with this even if we want to" well.. that will be shitty for everyone involved and probably the scene as a whole.

[quote=Asec][/quote]

No.

The league is fine, I encourage everyone to take part if they think it'll be fun. People enjoy the other RGL leagues - I've said this many times lately and mean it. My take on the league is irrelevant because I don't play.

A main selling point is literally that data will be sent to Valve. This is outlined very specifically on the website. And I see people coming out of the woodwork in this thread like "Well hey, it can't hurt."

My stance is very simple - sounds good but don't sell folks on Valve doing something with data if you're totally making that up and haven't spoken to Valve about it first. This is not a major piece of it, this doesn't hold up the league, it's not a crime etc, and sure you can do positive shit without Valve. But if folks are going to give their time and effort to this because they are being led to believe that Valve will get data, and that will somehow do something, I just hope they can find out NOW if it's not true or correct, rather than at season's end.

And sure, many people may not care about that! Maybe nobody cares, maybe everyone's happy to play whether or not anything will happen - I'm sure many will and that's cool. But with "improving competitive" and "the future of competitive" and all these buzzwords being thrown around.. I mean "Valve gets data and improves our game" is the ultimate pipe dream, and has been for 10 years, right? People will buy into this really fucking easily and quickly - it's close to our hearts. I think it's fair for players to want to know whether it's BS or not.

And absolutely, if nobody cares at all, then I'll shut up. But I think this is a fair thing to want details on. If the season is finished and we send over.. whatever data, I guess the survey details or whatever, and Valve says like "Uh we don't have enough people, we can't do anything with this even if we want to" well.. that will be shitty for everyone involved and probably the scene as a whole.
87
#87
0 Frags +
GetawhaleAsecGood reasoning

Thanks for clarifying, I understand the point you are making now.
People shouldn't play this because they expect (that word again) anything.
Play it of you are driven to do so. Don't do things you feel like you should do ("I should endure suffering through this as a sacrifice to give Valve the holy data").

Thanks again for the insightful response :)

[quote=Getawhale][quote=Asec][/quote]
Good reasoning [/quote]

Thanks for clarifying, I understand the point you are making now.
People shouldn't play this because they expect (that word again) anything.
Play it of you are driven to do so. Don't do things you feel like you should do ("I should endure suffering through this as a sacrifice to give Valve the holy data").

Thanks again for the insightful response :)
88
#88
23 Frags +

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OalWDhYfdeg

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OalWDhYfdeg[/youtube]
89
#89
-1 Frags +

whoa dude you could have like 2 separate combos or 5 demos/engies on a last hold. it may be aids to play but it'll certainly be interesting to watch

whoa dude you could have like 2 separate combos or 5 demos/engies on a last hold. it may be aids to play but it'll certainly be interesting to watch
90
#90
-3 Frags +

because the game being "interesting" to watch is more important than fun to play?

because the game being "interesting" to watch is more important than fun to play?
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