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shotgun pocket = noob?
1
#1
0 Frags +

Somewhere around a year ago or so when I was taking a break from the game, the Pocket meta switched from running shotgun to running gunboats. I, being stubborn, decided to keep shotgun when playing pocket, but I keep being called out for it by enemy gamers, as though I'm being "cheap" or "nooby".

I don't get why the mentality changed. Why do pocket mains run gunboats now? This is especially confusing to me when I never see them go for high bombs or sacks or any kind of play that relies on consistent jumping and HP management. Why is running the shotgun and owning scouts seen as cheap? Have I just run into a series of salty players or am I legitimately harming my team?

Somewhere around a year ago or so when I was taking a break from the game, the Pocket meta switched from running shotgun to running gunboats. I, being stubborn, decided to keep shotgun when playing pocket, but I keep being called out for it by enemy gamers, as though I'm being "cheap" or "nooby".

I don't get why the mentality changed. Why do pocket mains run gunboats now? This is especially confusing to me when I never see them go for high bombs or sacks or any kind of play that relies on consistent jumping and HP management. Why is running the shotgun and owning scouts seen as cheap? Have I just run into a series of salty players or am I legitimately harming my team?
2
#2
34 Frags +

Both styles work, discuss with your team what they would prefer for you to use.

Both styles work, discuss with your team what they would prefer for you to use.
3
#3
15 Frags +

My team's fine with how I play, the salt only comes from enemy gamers. I've also noticed that in DM servers players are quicker to call people out for using the shotgun than they are to call out demomen that run only stickies.

lol?

My team's fine with how I play, the salt only comes from enemy gamers. I've also noticed that in DM servers players are quicker to call people out for using the shotgun than they are to call out demomen that run only stickies.

lol?
4
#4
47 Frags +

people often get salty cause they aren't used to a soldier being able to follow up damage with hitscan like that. not really considered nooby, just a bit annoying by some

people often get salty cause they aren't used to a soldier being able to follow up damage with hitscan like that. not really considered nooby, just a bit annoying by some
5
#5
20 Frags +

Provided you are actually trying to practice dm in dm, who cares what others think. Gunboats are more common due to being able to keep up sustained pressure as well as allowing your scouts to get healed more often in fights. Provided you understand the downsides, stop trying to let bad gamers in a practice mode dictate how you play the game.

Provided you are actually trying to practice dm in dm, who cares what others think. Gunboats are more common due to being able to keep up sustained pressure as well as allowing your scouts to get healed more often in fights. Provided you understand the downsides, stop trying to let bad gamers in a practice mode dictate how you play the game.
6
#6
32 Frags +

Gunboats pocket means that you don't take as much heals/Uber and your demo and scouts get more of it. Scouts are currently widely considered to be the best class in the game so giving them more heals/Uber is considered to be a more optimal way to play tf2. Having a pocket scout, like a lot of top teams do in the current meta also means that you don't need a shotgun as much because your scout is there to clean up your dmg.

However, this is only an optimal way to play at higher levels which is where scouts truly hit their peak and their usefulness. Lower level players tend to parrot what's done at higher levels without really understanding why it's done, so you see shit like shotgun pockets being called out for being noobs "because prem/invite pockets run gunboats" and at the same time, having teams with gunboats pockets that still play passive as shit and take 40% heals while their scouts just overextend and feed with no buffs or uber

Gunboats pocket means that you don't take as much heals/Uber and your demo and scouts get more of it. Scouts are currently widely considered to be the best class in the game so giving them more heals/Uber is considered to be a more optimal way to play tf2. Having a pocket scout, like a lot of top teams do in the current meta also means that you don't need a shotgun as much because your scout is there to clean up your dmg.

However, this is only an optimal way to play at higher levels which is where scouts truly hit their peak and their usefulness. Lower level players tend to parrot what's done at higher levels without really understanding why it's done, so you see shit like shotgun pockets being called out for being noobs "because prem/invite pockets run gunboats" and at the same time, having teams with gunboats pockets that still play passive as shit and take 40% heals while their scouts just overextend and feed with no buffs or uber
7
#7
20 Frags +

Many thanks. These are opinions I held but I wasn't sure if I wasn't just being thickheaded. The shotgun shall continue to flow.

Many thanks. These are opinions I held but I wasn't sure if I wasn't just being thickheaded. The shotgun shall continue to flow.
8
#8
10 Frags +

a lot of people think if you run shotgun its because you can't hit rockets, which obviously isn't true because all the shotgun does is let you hit more. they think its easy to hit shotgun, but most of the players that say this have terrible shotgun.

every pocket but 1 at the last international lan ran shotgun on and off. its just that a lot of the newer players who started after i49 think that gunboats is a straight upgrade from the stock cause they've seen prem players use it. you become more heal reliant, but if you play it properly that doesn't matter. if you watch showstopper's stream, yeah they're pugs, but a lot of the time he kills like half their team with it in situations where his team wouldn't of had those kills.

corsato continue what nursey was saying, when playing with rando or paddie, I have never noticed them taking away "my heals" more than any other gunboats soldier, for the most part. In fact, I felt like some gunboats pockets like b4nny actually took/take a significant larger amount of heals in certain situations than rando/paddie running shotgun, whether or not they got more/less heals on logs..
a lot of people think if you run shotgun its because you can't hit rockets, which obviously isn't true because all the shotgun does is let you hit more. they think its easy to hit shotgun, but most of the players that say this have terrible shotgun.

every pocket but 1 at the last international lan ran shotgun on and off. its just that a lot of the newer players who started after i49 think that gunboats is a straight upgrade from the stock cause they've seen prem players use it. you become more heal reliant, but if you play it properly that doesn't matter. if you watch showstopper's stream, yeah they're pugs, but a lot of the time he kills like half their team with it in situations where his team wouldn't of had those kills.

[quote=corsa]to continue what nursey was saying, when playing with rando or paddie, I have never noticed them taking away "my heals" more than any other gunboats soldier, for the most part. In fact, I felt like some gunboats pockets like b4nny actually took/take a significant larger amount of heals in certain situations than rando/paddie running shotgun, whether or not they got more/less heals on logs..[/quote]
9
#9
-20 Frags +

.

.
10
#10
18 Frags +

People do what they're told is good and then bandwagon like they know why.

I prefer gunboats mind

People do what they're told is good and then bandwagon like they know why.

I prefer gunboats mind
11
#11
19 Frags +

I am old and thus prefer even seeing shotgun roamer from time to time. I mean how often are you gonna jump during a gullywash mid --) 2 stalemate? May as well scare the shit out of some scout by whipping a shotgun out on him in big door lol.

I am old and thus prefer even seeing shotgun roamer from time to time. I mean how often are you gonna jump during a gullywash mid --) 2 stalemate? May as well scare the shit out of some scout by whipping a shotgun out on him in big door lol.
12
#12
26 Frags +

who the fuck uses gunboats in dm? calling someone out for using shotgun in dm is the dumbest thing ive ever heard

who the fuck uses gunboats in dm? calling someone out for using shotgun in dm is the dumbest thing ive ever heard
13
#13
45 Frags +

scout mains lol

scout mains lol
14
#14
5 Frags +
MarxistI am old and thus prefer even seeing shotgun roamer from time to time. I mean how often are you gonna jump during a gullywash mid --) 2 stalemate? May as well scare the shit out of some scout by whipping a shotgun out on him in big door lol.

my nigga, agree 100%

all these gunboats roamer that never even put the unlock to use smh #bringbackshotgunroamer

trippawho the fuck uses gunboats in dm? calling someone out for using shotgun in dm is the dumbest thing ive ever heard

happens to me pretty often and I only whip it out when I run out of rockets anyway. idk

[quote=Marxist]I am old and thus prefer even seeing shotgun roamer from time to time. I mean how often are you gonna jump during a gullywash mid --) 2 stalemate? May as well scare the shit out of some scout by whipping a shotgun out on him in big door lol.[/quote]
my nigga, agree 100%

all these gunboats roamer that never even put the unlock to use smh #bringbackshotgunroamer

[quote=trippa]who the fuck uses gunboats in dm? calling someone out for using shotgun in dm is the dumbest thing ive ever heard[/quote]
happens to me pretty often and I only whip it out when I run out of rockets anyway. idk
15
#15
15 Frags +

I've noticed a lot of newer pockets have very good rockets but as soon as they pull out a shotgun they have parkinson's.
It's more of a product of the times than anything else.

Show Content
also scouts hate being contested in dm
I've noticed a lot of newer pockets have very good rockets but as soon as they pull out a shotgun they have parkinson's.
It's more of a product of the times than anything else.

[spoiler]also scouts hate being contested in dm[/spoiler]
16
#16
6 Frags +

I think its very map dependent. I see a lot of pockets running gunboats even on last which in my opinion is dire on gully for instance. But then there's pocket soldiers playing mids with shotgun on process mid too. I think the key is to be flexible and use whichever weapon feels better on whichever part of the map and make sure you're playing your part

I think its very map dependent. I see a lot of pockets running gunboats even on last which in my opinion is dire on gully for instance. But then there's pocket soldiers playing mids with shotgun on process mid too. I think the key is to be flexible and use whichever weapon feels better on whichever part of the map and make sure you're playing your part
17
#17
1 Frags +

On some scout maps like sunshine and reckoner I use gunboats. On other maps I might use shotgun to help out my scouts

On some scout maps like sunshine and reckoner I use gunboats. On other maps I might use shotgun to help out my scouts
18
#18
17 Frags +
bl4nkshotgun is for people who can actually aim
[quote=bl4nk]shotgun is for people who can actually aim[/quote]
19
#19
0 Frags +

You need to be flexible, shotgun pocket is still more than viable just not to mids (especially process/granary), banners are awesome for stalemates. Shotgun is possibly the worst option (gunboats/banner/shotgun) but still good enough to be fully viable. In the end it's just if you can play the right role where you don't steal heals from scouts and demo.

You need to be flexible, shotgun pocket is still more than viable just not to mids (especially process/granary), banners are awesome for stalemates. Shotgun is possibly the worst option (gunboats/banner/shotgun) but still good enough to be fully viable. In the end it's just if you can play the right role where you don't steal heals from scouts and demo.
20
#20
2 Frags +

Shotgun is the greatest thing on open last like Snakewater
But you gotta switch to gunboats to repush and control areas faster

Shotgun is the greatest thing on open last like Snakewater
But you gotta switch to gunboats to repush and control areas faster
21
#21
14 Frags +

Shotgun pocket still works man if ur good with it use it

Shotgun pocket still works man if ur good with it use it
22
#22
0 Frags +

its really just playstyle at this point
some prefer playing a long leash gunboats pocket who can make space with his roamer and free up heals compared to banner/shotty
shotty is good vs scouts + in ubers, and cleaning up dmg in general
banner provides a lot of utility but you need a team that actually knows how to play around it. its kind of like playing with shotty where you're not as free to jump away since you need to survive but your team can base new strategies around it, a lot like a "miniuber"

its really just playstyle at this point
some prefer playing a long leash gunboats pocket who can make space with his roamer and free up heals compared to banner/shotty
shotty is good vs scouts + in ubers, and cleaning up dmg in general
banner provides a lot of utility but you need a team that actually knows how to play around it. its kind of like playing with shotty where you're not as free to jump away since you need to survive but your team can base new strategies around it, a lot like a "miniuber"
23
#23
13 Frags +

If you take more than 35% heals running shotgun, you're playing it wrong

If you take more than 35% heals running shotgun, you're playing it wrong
24
#24
27 Frags +

airforever: nice shotty
airforever: you cunthead
airforever: its 2k17

:(

airforever: nice shotty
airforever: you cunthead
airforever: its 2k17

:(
25
#25
17 Frags +

The main reason for the decline of shotgun pocket is the increasing importance of scouts in the meta. With the heal-speed buff and the increasing general skill level of scouts to a point where most high level scouts will rarely miss shots anymore, scout has become a much more efficient and desirable heal target in most teams, as a constantly 185 pocket scout can be highly effective in both cleaning up the damage of his combo players and protecting his medic from jumpers. Given this fact, the strict 'pocket soldier' role, who tanks heals and can 1v1 any single enemy with the help of their shotgun, has been moved away from in favour of a more 'roamer-pocket' style who will make space and initiate in fights but who will allow more of the heals to be put on the demo and pocket scout so that they can clean up. The reason most players do not expect a shotgun pocket is that most current teams would prefer to have the pocket scout fulfill the role of the pocket's shotgun, which they can do a lot more effectively and without 'waddling' and eating unnecessary damage, a cardinal sin of soldier play in the current year.

The main reason for the decline of shotgun pocket is the increasing importance of scouts in the meta. With the heal-speed buff and the increasing general skill level of scouts to a point where most high level scouts will rarely miss shots anymore, scout has become a much more efficient and desirable heal target in most teams, as a constantly 185 pocket scout can be highly effective in both cleaning up the damage of his combo players and protecting his medic from jumpers. Given this fact, the strict 'pocket soldier' role, who tanks heals and can 1v1 any single enemy with the help of their shotgun, has been moved away from in favour of a more 'roamer-pocket' style who will make space and initiate in fights but who will allow more of the heals to be put on the demo and pocket scout so that they can clean up. The reason most players do not expect a shotgun pocket is that most current teams would prefer to have the pocket scout fulfill the role of the pocket's shotgun, which they can do a lot more effectively and without 'waddling' and eating unnecessary damage, a cardinal sin of soldier play in the current year.
26
#26
9 Frags +
georgebaiiairforever: nice shotty
airforever: you cunthead
airforever: its 2k17

:(

meanwhile they ran permasniper for the whole scrim smh.

[quote=georgebaii]airforever: nice shotty
airforever: you cunthead
airforever: its 2k17

:([/quote]

meanwhile they ran permasniper for the whole scrim smh.
27
#27
11 Frags +

If you have bad scouts or are the focal point of your team running shotgun is fine. Nothing more annoying than shit constantly living with sub 30 hp.

That being said if youre hitting 9 dmg shots or not using it properly its not worth the mobility trade off

If you have bad scouts or are the focal point of your team running shotgun is fine. Nothing more annoying than shit constantly living with sub 30 hp.

That being said if youre hitting 9 dmg shots or not using it properly its not worth the mobility trade off
28
#28
-5 Frags +

Gunboats Roamer = noob?

Gunboats Roamer = noob?
29
#29
8 Frags +

Shotgun pocket = Cheeto :)

Shotgun pocket = Cheeto :)
30
#30
12 Frags +

gunboats pocket is a scheme made by the tf2 Illuminati scout mains who wanted to make it so its harder for soldiers to play against scouts

gunboats pocket is a scheme made by the tf2 Illuminati scout mains who wanted to make it so its harder for soldiers to play against scouts
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