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Game of Thrones S8
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1
#1
0 Frags +

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NxwzIFIXYA

https://media.tenor.com/images/38aeadabe608f318eb90e5522167fe57/tenor.gif

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NxwzIFIXYA
[img]https://media.tenor.com/images/38aeadabe608f318eb90e5522167fe57/tenor.gif[/img]
2
#2
9 Frags +

oh my god

oh my god
3
#3
11 Frags +

At first, GRRM was saying "NO" to every hollywood producer because he didn't want his books and characters he loved so dearly and had worked on for so many years to be swallowed by hollywood with mindless action. He didn't want the stupid writing that makes no sense and exists solely to advance the plot without any sense or purpose. He didn't want his characters turned into two-dimensional vehicles that have no identity or depth and are only there to advanced the plot.

So he finally turns to Television, and meets a couple of dudes who promised they would stay true to his imagine and he really believed them. Imagine George grinning with pure joy as he watches season 1 of the show. Where it follows the book almost perfectly, with the actors HE wanted, with the stories and dialogue that he wrote.
Truly watching his world come to life.

I'm sorry George, i'm so so sorry.

At first, GRRM was saying "NO" to every hollywood producer because he didn't want his books and characters he loved so dearly and had worked on for so many years to be swallowed by hollywood with mindless action. He didn't want the stupid writing that makes no sense and exists solely to advance the plot without any sense or purpose. He didn't want his characters turned into two-dimensional vehicles that have no identity or depth and are only there to advanced the plot.

So he finally turns to Television, and meets a couple of dudes who promised they would stay true to his imagine and he really believed them. Imagine George grinning with pure joy as he watches season 1 of the show. Where it follows the book almost perfectly, with the actors HE wanted, with the stories and dialogue that he wrote.
Truly watching his world come to life.

I'm sorry George, i'm so so sorry.
4
#4
12 Frags +

i dont remember anything thats happened

i dont remember anything thats happened
5
#5
4 Frags +
lethi dont remember anything thats happened

https://youtu.be/l3hTmUKR7LI?t=100

One of the funniest moments in television history. Littlefinger pleads not guilty, then gets executed without any evidence or any type of trial whatsoever. He asks for a chance to defend himself against completely fabricated evidence, and then gets executed on the spot. Just like Ned taught them.

[quote=leth]i dont remember anything thats happened[/quote]

https://youtu.be/l3hTmUKR7LI?t=100

One of the funniest moments in television history. Littlefinger pleads not guilty, then gets executed without any evidence or any type of trial whatsoever. He asks for a chance to defend himself against completely fabricated evidence, and then gets executed on the spot. Just like Ned taught them.
6
#6
14 Frags +
sheepy_dogs_handAt first, GRRM was saying "NO" to every hollywood producer because he didn't want his books and characters he loved so dearly and had worked on for so many years to be swallowed by hollywood with mindless action. He didn't want the stupid writing that makes no sense and exists solely to advance the plot without any sense or purpose. He didn't want his characters turned into two-dimensional vehicles that have no identity or depth and are only there to advanced the plot.

So he finally turns to Television, and meets a couple of dudes who promised they would stay true to his imagine and he really believed them. Imagine George grinning with pure joy as he watches season 1 of the show. Where it follows the book almost perfectly, with the actors HE wanted, with the stories and dialogue that he wrote.
Truly watching his world come to life.

I'm sorry George, i'm so so sorry.

to be fair their job got much harder when they no longer had books for reference. its still a good series just not quite as good was it was at the start

[quote=sheepy_dogs_hand]At first, GRRM was saying "NO" to every hollywood producer because he didn't want his books and characters he loved so dearly and had worked on for so many years to be swallowed by hollywood with mindless action. He didn't want the stupid writing that makes no sense and exists solely to advance the plot without any sense or purpose. He didn't want his characters turned into two-dimensional vehicles that have no identity or depth and are only there to advanced the plot.

So he finally turns to Television, and meets a couple of dudes who promised they would stay true to his imagine and he really believed them. Imagine George grinning with pure joy as he watches season 1 of the show. Where it follows the book almost perfectly, with the actors HE wanted, with the stories and dialogue that he wrote.
Truly watching his world come to life.

I'm sorry George, i'm so so sorry.[/quote]

to be fair their job got much harder when they no longer had books for reference. its still a good series just not quite as good was it was at the start
7
#7
-2 Frags +
sheepy_dogs_handlethi dont remember anything thats happened
https://youtu.be/l3hTmUKR7LI?t=100

One of the funniest moments in television history. Littlefinger pleads not guilty, then gets executed without any evidence or any type of trial whatsoever. He asks for a chance to defend himself against completely fabricated evidence, and then gets executed on the spot. Just like Ned taught them.

pretty sure the whole point was that they can no longer totally rely on the world as they've seen it in the past. there's always been magic, but it's been muted, its influence much less direct. now with the white walkers coming, with an undead dragon in the fight, the use of magic must be much more direct, and our "heroes" know it--hence their total reliance on bran's sight to sentence littlefinger.

[quote=sheepy_dogs_hand][quote=leth]i dont remember anything thats happened[/quote]

https://youtu.be/l3hTmUKR7LI?t=100

One of the funniest moments in television history. Littlefinger pleads not guilty, then gets executed without any evidence or any type of trial whatsoever. He asks for a chance to defend himself against completely fabricated evidence, and then gets executed on the spot. Just like Ned taught them.[/quote]

pretty sure the whole point was that they can no longer totally rely on the world as they've seen it in the past. there's always been magic, but it's been muted, its influence much less direct. now with the white walkers coming, with an undead dragon in the fight, the use of magic must be much more direct, and our "heroes" know it--hence their total reliance on bran's sight to sentence littlefinger.
8
#8
5 Frags +

Don't care what anyone says this is still by far the best series around in terms of the insane scope of its plot and budget - super pumped for next season.

Don't care what anyone says this is still by far the best series around in terms of the insane scope of its plot and budget - super pumped for next season.
9
#9
17 Frags +

mmm I think the bigger problem with that scene is the fact that littlefinger is built up in the books as an extremely cunning, almost visionary person who can play the game like a chessboard, but when he's convicted of treason his rebuttals are:

"i'm a bit confused"
"none of you were there"
and "please sansa i've only protected you"

the show has always failed to make littlefinger appear as tactful as he is in the books, with precedent leading all the way back to season 1, the first time you see dialogue between littlefinger and cersei. littlefinger randomly says this inflammatory thing to cersei, showing that a) he wants her power and b) he isn't to be trusted, and cersei just fires back with this one-liner that renders him speechless. book lf would have done his best to both brown-nose as much as possible and avoid altercations with more powerful people he's trying to control.

it's been shit like this that turned me off from the show, leading all the way back to the first season. it needs to be said, though, that the first few seasons are MILES ahead of the last few from following book narratives to overall quality

mmm I think the bigger problem with that scene is the fact that littlefinger is built up in the books as an extremely cunning, almost visionary person who can play the game like a chessboard, but when he's convicted of treason his rebuttals are:

"i'm a bit confused"
"none of you were there"
and "please sansa i've only protected you"

the show has always failed to make littlefinger appear as tactful as he is in the books, with precedent leading all the way back to season 1, the first time you see dialogue between littlefinger and cersei. littlefinger randomly says this inflammatory thing to cersei, showing that a) he wants her power and b) he isn't to be trusted, and cersei just fires back with this one-liner that renders him speechless. book lf would have done his best to both brown-nose as much as possible and avoid altercations with more powerful people he's trying to control.

it's been shit like this that turned me off from the show, leading all the way back to the first season. it needs to be said, though, that the first few seasons are MILES ahead of the last few from following book narratives to overall quality
10
#10
1 Frags +

god dman it give me my books George, I want a 6th before you die. Don't u dare pull a Robert Jordan on me.

god dman it give me my books George, I want a 6th before you die. Don't u dare pull a Robert Jordan on me.
11
#11
ETF2L
6 Frags +

I have never watched a games of thrones episode.

I have never watched a games of thrones episode.
12
#12
2 Frags +
Menachem and our "heroes" know it--hence their total reliance on bran's sight to sentence littlefinger.

The Starks are obsessed with fair trials and their code of honour. If Littlefinger was accused, he would ask for evidence and a fair trial which would have to be given (or a trial by combat). Winterfell is the last place in the country that would suddenly lose its legal system.
Executing Littlefinger without a trial based on evidence that consisted of "bran had Magic visions" would have made Sansa look like a complete tyrant to all the nobles who were present and the people would have been shocked, especially considering he saved them all with his army and was one of the most powerful people in the country. .

Starkieto be fair their job got much harder when they no longer had books for reference. its still a good series just not quite as good was it was at the start

This is true, the reason the first seasons were so good was because of George. My problem is that whoever is currently writing the show doesn't seem to know anything about the characters.

Jamie, who is trying to be a noble knight and atone for his past deeds literally rapes cersei in the show. Tyrion goes from an intelligent politician to a useless idiot, Arya somehow 1v1s Brienne , Varys does literally nothing now, Stannis burns his own daughter alive ect.

I think the show is well made but has been ruined by several baffling decisions from the writers.

[quote=Menachem] and our "heroes" know it--hence their total reliance on bran's sight to sentence littlefinger.[/quote]

The Starks are obsessed with fair trials and their code of honour. If Littlefinger was accused, he would ask for evidence and a fair trial which would have to be given (or a trial by combat). Winterfell is the last place in the country that would suddenly lose its legal system.
Executing Littlefinger without a trial based on evidence that consisted of "bran had Magic visions" would have made Sansa look like a complete tyrant to all the nobles who were present and the people would have been shocked, especially considering he saved them all with his army and was one of the most powerful people in the country. .

[quote=Starkie]
to be fair their job got much harder when they no longer had books for reference. its still a good series just not quite as good was it was at the start[/quote]

This is true, the reason the first seasons were so good was because of George. My problem is that whoever is currently writing the show doesn't seem to know anything about the characters.

Jamie, who is trying to be a noble knight and atone for his past deeds literally rapes cersei in the show. Tyrion goes from an intelligent politician to a useless idiot, Arya somehow 1v1s Brienne , Varys does literally nothing now, Stannis burns his own daughter alive ect.

I think the show is well made but has been ruined by several baffling decisions from the writers.
13
#13
3 Frags +

at this point the storywriting is code geass season 2 tier so im actually looking forward for nice trainwreck to go up in flames

at this point the storywriting is code geass season 2 tier so im actually looking forward for nice trainwreck to go up in flames
14
#14
0 Frags +

>stannis burns his own daughter alive

Honestly, this one doesn't seem too out of character, he had 2 options

1. Don't burn her, most of his troops will desert, starve or freeze; ruining any chance he has of a successful battle, not to mention that there's a good chance Shireen would die in this scenario.

2. Burn her, lose his wife and a fraction of his troops but save many more people.

Stannis was always a cold pragmatist, no matter how much he loved Shireen he knew that the only way to get his army out of the blizzard was to make a sacrifice to the Red God.

>stannis burns his own daughter alive

Honestly, this one doesn't seem too out of character, he had 2 options

1. Don't burn her, most of his troops will desert, starve or freeze; ruining any chance he has of a successful battle, not to mention that there's a good chance Shireen would die in this scenario.

2. Burn her, lose his wife and a fraction of his troops but save many more people.

Stannis was always a cold pragmatist, no matter how much he loved Shireen he knew that the only way to get his army out of the blizzard was to make a sacrifice to the Red God.
15
#15
1 Frags +

hoping the Night King can upgrade his mount to undead Drogon

hoping the Night King can upgrade his mount to undead Drogon
16
#16
5 Frags +

It's just above-average fan fiction at this point.

Let's get this shit out the way so we can await the real deal - Denis Villeneuve's adaptation of Dune.

It's just above-average fan fiction at this point.

Let's get this shit out the way so we can await the real deal - Denis Villeneuve's adaptation of Dune.
17
#17
3 Frags +
jetzzzzz>stannis burns his own daughter alive

Honestly, this one doesn't seem too out of character, he had 2 options

1. Don't burn her, most of his troops will desert, starve or freeze; ruining any chance he has of a successful battle, not to mention that there's a good chance Shireen would die in this scenario.

2. Burn her, lose his wife and a fraction of his troops but save many more people.

Stannis was always a cold pragmatist, no matter how much he loved Shireen he knew that the only way to get his army out of the blizzard was to make a sacrifice to the Red God.

This makes no sense. Most of his troops desert after seeing their leader literally burn his own daughter alive anyway. After Ramsay and his "20 good men" somehow managed to destroy their entire supply line (what a joke that was)

How could that possibly be the only 2 options he had. Stannis was known to be possibly the greatest military leader on the planet. He could have simply retreated to the wall, his daughter and wife were even offered to stay and return at any point. Stannis was cold yet honorable, he would never burn his daughter alive like that. He knew he was outnumbered and had little chance of victory.

Stannis would have sent his daughter and wife away, fought and died in battle. That is how his character has been written since 1996. He is cold and stubborn but not a fucking psycho who would burn his own daughter alive at the stake. He always had a sense of honour and kinslaying in Game of Thrones is well known to be incredibly dishonorable.

I dunno how people can defend this, even if you haven't read the books. It was done for a cheap shock, something the show feels the needs to keep doing.

[quote=jetzzzzz]>stannis burns his own daughter alive

Honestly, this one doesn't seem too out of character, he had 2 options

1. Don't burn her, most of his troops will desert, starve or freeze; ruining any chance he has of a successful battle, not to mention that there's a good chance Shireen would die in this scenario.

2. Burn her, lose his wife and a fraction of his troops but save many more people.

Stannis was always a cold pragmatist, no matter how much he loved Shireen he knew that the only way to get his army out of the blizzard was to make a sacrifice to the Red God.[/quote]

This makes no sense. Most of his troops desert after seeing their leader literally burn his own daughter alive anyway. After Ramsay and his "20 good men" somehow managed to destroy their entire supply line (what a joke that was)

How could that possibly be the only 2 options he had. Stannis was known to be possibly the greatest military leader on the planet. He could have simply retreated to the wall, his daughter and wife were even offered to stay and return at any point. Stannis was cold yet honorable, he would never burn his daughter alive like that. He knew he was outnumbered and had little chance of victory.

Stannis would have sent his daughter and wife away, fought and died in battle. That is how his character has been written since 1996. He is cold and stubborn but not a fucking psycho who would burn his own daughter alive at the stake. He always had a sense of honour and kinslaying in Game of Thrones is well known to be incredibly dishonorable.

I dunno how people can defend this, even if you haven't read the books. It was done for a cheap shock, something the show feels the needs to keep doing.
18
#18
4 Frags +
jetzzzzz>stannis burns his own daughter alive

Honestly, this one doesn't seem too out of character, he had 2 options

1. Don't burn her, most of his troops will desert, starve or freeze; ruining any chance he has of a successful battle, not to mention that there's a good chance Shireen would die in this scenario.

2. Burn her, lose his wife and a fraction of his troops but save many more people.

Stannis was always a cold pragmatist, no matter how much he loved Shireen he knew that the only way to get his army out of the blizzard was to make a sacrifice to the Red God.

Stannis sacrificing Shireen is almost definitely going to happen in the books given that GRR told Beinoff and Weiss certain major plot beats, from a thematic standpoint it works perfectly in concluding Stannis' character arc. The problem was always that especially in later seasons the time and space needed to build up to these events was never actually provided. That's why it really comes across as kinda confusing in the show

[quote=jetzzzzz]>stannis burns his own daughter alive

Honestly, this one doesn't seem too out of character, he had 2 options

1. Don't burn her, most of his troops will desert, starve or freeze; ruining any chance he has of a successful battle, not to mention that there's a good chance Shireen would die in this scenario.

2. Burn her, lose his wife and a fraction of his troops but save many more people.

Stannis was always a cold pragmatist, no matter how much he loved Shireen he knew that the only way to get his army out of the blizzard was to make a sacrifice to the Red God.[/quote]

Stannis sacrificing Shireen is almost definitely going to happen in the books given that GRR told Beinoff and Weiss certain major plot beats, from a thematic standpoint it works perfectly in concluding Stannis' character arc. The problem was always that especially in later seasons the time and space needed to build up to these events was never actually provided. That's why it really comes across as kinda confusing in the show
19
#19
4 Frags +

i just wanna see boobies :D

i just wanna see boobies :D
20
#20
3 Frags +
sheepy_dogs_handThe Starks are obsessed with fair trials and their code of honour. If Littlefinger was accused, he would ask for evidence and a fair trial which would have to be given (or a trial by combat). Winterfell is the last place in the country that would suddenly lose its legal system.
Executing Littlefinger without a trial based on evidence that consisted of "bran had Magic visions" would have made Sansa look like a complete tyrant to all the nobles who were present and the people would have been shocked, especially considering he saved them all with his army and was one of the most powerful people in the country. .

I've never read the books, and I don't think they should play too deeply into discussions about the show. Not saying you can't prefer the books over the show, but it seems like every discussion I come across devolves into complaining about how different the two are. This thread is about the TV series, so I'd like to discuss that instead.

Since when are Sansa and Arya obsessed with fair trials? They've both spent the last several years experiencing some of the worst that humanity has to offer. Their last experience with Stark honor was watching their father pointlessly die for it. Arya certainly would feel no qualms about killing without a trial at this point, and Sansa has put up with Littlefinger's shit for so long, I imagine she's been dreaming of killing him for years. As for how the rest of the lords at Winterfell would feel about execution without a classically fair trial? Like I said, everyone at Winterfell has had to very quickly accept the fact that magical, unexplainable events are about to play a huge role in their lives and deaths, and need to adapt to this new reality. At one point, Winterfell might have been the last place to abandon it's traditional legal system, but now it's going to be the first city to fall to the white walkers, so necessity dictates otherwise. It's not difficult at all to demonstrate to any man the extent of Bran's sight, and right now the top priority is to consolidate power; to cut out any weak links that might make fighting the undead any more difficult. Winter's coming, winds are blowing, et cetera, and I think any man in the position of the lords at Winterfell would just be grateful to have a strong leader whose word they can follow. Doesn't seem far fetched to me that they'd be desperate enough to just be happy they've got some magical all-seeing mage on their side. That, or they'd fear him enough that they wouldn't dream of revolting. Either way, they presumably all believe in the threat, and the last thing any of them are going to do is rock the boat during a hurricane.

[quote=sheepy_dogs_hand]
The Starks are obsessed with fair trials and their code of honour. If Littlefinger was accused, he would ask for evidence and a fair trial which would have to be given (or a trial by combat). Winterfell is the last place in the country that would suddenly lose its legal system.
Executing Littlefinger without a trial based on evidence that consisted of "bran had Magic visions" would have made Sansa look like a complete tyrant to all the nobles who were present and the people would have been shocked, especially considering he saved them all with his army and was one of the most powerful people in the country. .
[/quote]
I've never read the books, and I don't think they should play too deeply into discussions about the show. Not saying you can't prefer the books over the show, but it seems like every discussion I come across devolves into complaining about how different the two are. This thread is about the TV series, so I'd like to discuss that instead.

Since when are Sansa and Arya obsessed with fair trials? They've both spent the last several years experiencing some of the worst that humanity has to offer. Their last experience with Stark honor was watching their father pointlessly die for it. Arya certainly would feel no qualms about killing without a trial at this point, and Sansa has put up with Littlefinger's shit for so long, I imagine she's been dreaming of killing him for years. As for how the rest of the lords at Winterfell would feel about execution without a classically fair trial? Like I said, everyone at Winterfell has had to very quickly accept the fact that magical, unexplainable events are about to play a huge role in their lives and deaths, and need to adapt to this new reality. At one point, Winterfell might have been the last place to abandon it's traditional legal system, but now it's going to be the first city to fall to the white walkers, so necessity dictates otherwise. It's not difficult at all to demonstrate to any man the extent of Bran's sight, and right now the top priority is to consolidate power; to cut out any weak links that might make fighting the undead any more difficult. Winter's coming, winds are blowing, et cetera, and I think any man in the position of the lords at Winterfell would just be grateful to have a strong leader whose word they can follow. Doesn't seem far fetched to me that they'd be desperate enough to just be happy they've got some magical all-seeing mage on their side. That, or they'd fear him enough that they wouldn't dream of revolting. Either way, they presumably all believe in the threat, and the last thing any of them are going to do is rock the boat during a hurricane.
21
#21
1 Frags +
RussianGuyovichIt's just above-average fan fiction at this point.

This is really accurate. GOT used to be such a subtle masterpiece of political cunning and everything (from the sets to the costumes to the dialog) was meticulous. Now it's just a slightly above average fantasy series with an enormous budget.

[quote=RussianGuyovich]It's just above-average fan fiction at this point. [/quote]

This is really accurate. GOT used to be such a subtle masterpiece of political cunning and everything (from the sets to the costumes to the dialog) was meticulous. Now it's just a slightly above average fantasy series with an enormous budget.
22
#22
1 Frags +
K1Stannis sacrificing Shireen is almost definitely going to happen in the books given that GRR told Beinoff and Weiss certain major plot beats

This is definitely not true at all. George isn't even on the last book, he is still finishing the 2nd last one with hundreds of ideas, plot points, characters and backstories to come up with. Any writer will tell you that a story you are writing never ends in the way you thought it would and an idea that seemed good at first will be gone the next day. I can assure you that Stannis will not burn shrireen in the books. GRRM has been throwing them random ideas whenever he can, most of which will never come to light. If Stannis does burn Shireen in the books, it will be written in character, although I don't think that's possible.

MenachemI've never read the books, and I don't think they should play too deeply into discussions about the show. Not saying you can't prefer the books over the show, but it seems like every discussion I come across devolves into complaining about how different the two are. This thread is about the TV series, so I'd like to discuss that instead.

This is true but you need to keep in mind that I am actually following the characters from the show here, perhaps with just a little more insight. You need to keep in mind that the first season followed the book almost page for page. The only differences were the ages of some of the characters. The characters in the show had been set up in the first few seasons from the books. So when you ask why Sansa (maybe not Arya) would be obsessed with a fair trial it goes back to the very first season where Ned beheads the deserter of the Nights Watch and teaches his children the importance of Stark tradition and honour, and how to them it is absolute.

Many of the Lords of the North are still skeptical about the magic and white walkers and even if they weren't, they would be appalled to see the Lady of Winterfell slit a mans throat right in front of them in the room that they are standing in. That's not how executions are done here, executing somebody in the grand hall is something that the Mad King would do. My problem is not that they are ruining the book characters like Euron, I can understand that. My problem with the show is they are ruining the characters that were set up in the show over 8 years ago.

[quote=K1]
Stannis sacrificing Shireen is almost definitely going to happen in the books given that GRR told Beinoff and Weiss certain major plot beats[/quote]

This is definitely not true at all. George isn't even on the last book, he is still finishing the 2nd last one with hundreds of ideas, plot points, characters and backstories to come up with. Any writer will tell you that a story you are writing never ends in the way you thought it would and an idea that seemed good at first will be gone the next day. I can assure you that Stannis will not burn shrireen in the books. GRRM has been throwing them random ideas whenever he can, most of which will never come to light. If Stannis does burn Shireen in the books, it will be written in character, although I don't think that's possible.


[quote=Menachem]
I've never read the books, and I don't think they should play too deeply into discussions about the show. Not saying you can't prefer the books over the show, but it seems like every discussion I come across devolves into complaining about how different the two are. This thread is about the TV series, so I'd like to discuss that instead.[/quote]

This is true but you need to keep in mind that I am actually following the characters from the show here, perhaps with just a little more insight. You need to keep in mind that the first season followed the book almost page for page. The only differences were the ages of some of the characters. The characters in the show had been set up in the first few seasons from the books. So when you ask why Sansa (maybe not Arya) would be obsessed with a fair trial it goes back to the very first season where Ned beheads the deserter of the Nights Watch and teaches his children the importance of Stark tradition and honour, and how to them it is absolute.

Many of the Lords of the North are still skeptical about the magic and white walkers and even if they weren't, they would be appalled to see the Lady of Winterfell slit a mans throat right in front of them in the room that they are standing in. That's not how executions are done here, executing somebody in the grand hall is something that the Mad King would do. My problem is not that they are ruining the book characters like Euron, I can understand that. My problem with the show is they are ruining the characters that were set up in the show over 8 years ago.
23
#23
0 Frags +
sheepy_dogs_handK1Stannis sacrificing Shireen is almost definitely going to happen in the books given that GRR told Beinoff and Weiss certain major plot beats
This is definitely not true at all. George isn't even on the last book, he is still finishing the 2nd last one with hundreds of ideas, plot points, characters and backstories to come up with. Any writer will tell you that a story you are writing never ends in the way you thought it would and an idea that seemed good at first will be gone the next day. I can assure you that Stannis will not burn shrireen in the books. GRRM has been throwing them random ideas whenever he can, most of which will never come to light. If Stannis does burn Shireen in the books, it will be written in character, although I don't think that's possible.
MenachemI've never read the books, and I don't think they should play too deeply into discussions about the show. Not saying you can't prefer the books over the show, but it seems like every discussion I come across devolves into complaining about how different the two are. This thread is about the TV series, so I'd like to discuss that instead.
This is true but you need to keep in mind that I am actually following the characters from the show here, perhaps with just a little more insight. You need to keep in mind that the first season followed the book almost page for page. The only differences were the ages of some of the characters. The characters in the show had been set up in the first few seasons from the books. So when you ask why Sansa (maybe not Arya) would be obsessed with a fair trial it goes back to the very first season where Ned beheads the deserter of the Nights Watch and teaches his children the importance of Stark tradition and honour, and how to them it is absolute.

Many of the Lords of the North are still skeptical about the magic and white walkers and even if they weren't, they would be appalled to see the Lady of Winterfell slit a mans throat right in front of them in the room that they are standing in. That's not how executions are done here, executing somebody in the grand hall is something that the Mad King would do. My problem is not that they are ruining the book characters like Euron, I can understand that. My problem with the show is they are ruining the characters that were set up in the show over 8 years ago.

They're definitely ruining characters but I think the reason that lords appeared okay with it is because Littlefinger was now revealed to have caused Ned's death.

[quote=sheepy_dogs_hand][quote=K1]
Stannis sacrificing Shireen is almost definitely going to happen in the books given that GRR told Beinoff and Weiss certain major plot beats[/quote]

This is definitely not true at all. George isn't even on the last book, he is still finishing the 2nd last one with hundreds of ideas, plot points, characters and backstories to come up with. Any writer will tell you that a story you are writing never ends in the way you thought it would and an idea that seemed good at first will be gone the next day. I can assure you that Stannis will not burn shrireen in the books. GRRM has been throwing them random ideas whenever he can, most of which will never come to light. If Stannis does burn Shireen in the books, it will be written in character, although I don't think that's possible.


[quote=Menachem]
I've never read the books, and I don't think they should play too deeply into discussions about the show. Not saying you can't prefer the books over the show, but it seems like every discussion I come across devolves into complaining about how different the two are. This thread is about the TV series, so I'd like to discuss that instead.[/quote]

This is true but you need to keep in mind that I am actually following the characters from the show here, perhaps with just a little more insight. You need to keep in mind that the first season followed the book almost page for page. The only differences were the ages of some of the characters. The characters in the show had been set up in the first few seasons from the books. So when you ask why Sansa (maybe not Arya) would be obsessed with a fair trial it goes back to the very first season where Ned beheads the deserter of the Nights Watch and teaches his children the importance of Stark tradition and honour, and how to them it is absolute.

Many of the Lords of the North are still skeptical about the magic and white walkers and even if they weren't, they would be appalled to see the Lady of Winterfell slit a mans throat right in front of them in the room that they are standing in. That's not how executions are done here, executing somebody in the grand hall is something that the Mad King would do. My problem is not that they are ruining the book characters like Euron, I can understand that. My problem with the show is they are ruining the characters that were set up in the show over 8 years ago.[/quote]


They're definitely ruining characters but I think the reason that lords appeared okay with it is because Littlefinger was now revealed to have caused Ned's death.
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#24
4 Frags +

owner of the Iron Throne after season 8

Show Content
owner of the Iron Throne after season 8

[spoiler][img]https://uproxx.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/lady-mormont.jpg?quality=100&w=650[/img][/spoiler]
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#25
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https://i.imgur.com/IP8fPwZ.gifv

https://i.imgur.com/IP8fPwZ.gifv
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#26
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You can set a character in a given frame, and then make them evolve because of the things they have been through. I wasnt too surprised that Sansa became who she is now, because honestly who would stay the same after enduring so much shit.
Sansa had to deal with so much unfair events throughout the show, it's pretty fair for her to "give back" at some point. She's not the naive little maiden that she used to be, she toughen up, and seeks revenge, not justice.

You can set a character in a given frame, and then make them evolve because of the things they have been through. I wasnt too surprised that Sansa became who she is now, because honestly who would stay the same after enduring so much shit.
Sansa had to deal with so much unfair events throughout the show, it's pretty fair for her to "give back" at some point. She's not the naive little maiden that she used to be, she toughen up, and seeks revenge, not justice.
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#27
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sheepy_dogs_handMenachem and our "heroes" know it--hence their total reliance on bran's sight to sentence littlefinger.
The Starks are obsessed with fair trials and their code of honour. If Littlefinger was accused, he would ask for evidence and a fair trial which would have to be given (or a trial by combat). Winterfell is the last place in the country that would suddenly lose its legal system.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Jquz24k-Y8&t=1m16s

wow what a fair trial.

[quote=sheepy_dogs_hand][quote=Menachem] and our "heroes" know it--hence their total reliance on bran's sight to sentence littlefinger.[/quote]

The Starks are obsessed with fair trials and their code of honour. If Littlefinger was accused, he would ask for evidence and a fair trial which would have to be given (or a trial by combat). Winterfell is the last place in the country that would suddenly lose its legal system. [/quote]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Jquz24k-Y8&t=1m16s

wow what a fair trial.
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#28
0 Frags +

Just to elaborate, a "fair trial" has never been part fo the books or show. There is no established legal system of "fair trials" in Westeros. . A (rigged) trial was afforded to Tyrion as a gesture due to his status, and as a way for Tywin to keep his hands clean from the perceived grievous sin of kinslaying.

Lords have the right to "pit and gallows" ie: can legally put anyone of lower feudal status within their lands to death, this has been established numerous times in the books, and was established in season one with Ned "passsing sentence" on a deserter. No trial.

Just to elaborate, a "fair trial" has never been part fo the books or show. There is no established legal system of "fair trials" in Westeros. . A (rigged) trial was afforded to Tyrion as a gesture due to his status, and as a way for Tywin to keep his hands clean from the perceived grievous sin of kinslaying.

Lords have the right to "pit and gallows" ie: can legally put anyone of lower feudal status within their lands to death, this has been established numerous times in the books, and was established in season one with Ned "passsing sentence" on a deserter. No trial.
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#29
1 Frags +
OmbrackYou can set a character in a given frame, and then make them evolve because of the things they have been through. I wasnt too surprised that Sansa became who she is now, because honestly who would stay the same after enduring so much shit.
Sansa had to deal with so much unfair events throughout the show, it's pretty fair for her to "give back" at some point. She's not the naive little maiden that she used to be, she toughen up, and seeks revenge, not justice.

Maybe with Sansa. Still doesn't apply for Jamie raping his sister, Littlefinger, Varys and Tyrion being idiots.

BarryChuckleJust to elaborate, a "fair trial" has never been part fo the books or show. There is no established legal system of "fair trials" in Westeros. . A (rigged) trial was afforded to Tyrion as a gesture due to his status, and as a way for Tywin to keep his hands clean from the perceived grievous sin of kinslaying.

Lords have the right to "pit and gallows" ie: can legally put anyone of lower feudal status within their lands to death, this has been established numerous times in the books, and was established in season one with Ned "passsing sentence" on a deserter. No trial.

There was no trial because the dude literally confessed to being a deserter of the Nights Watch. If somebody is accused of something, and they deny it, there tends to be some kind of due process. Especially in a place like Winterfell.

[quote=Ombrack]You can set a character in a given frame, and then make them evolve because of the things they have been through. I wasnt too surprised that Sansa became who she is now, because honestly who would stay the same after enduring so much shit.
Sansa had to deal with so much unfair events throughout the show, it's pretty fair for her to "give back" at some point. She's not the naive little maiden that she used to be, she toughen up, and seeks revenge, not justice.[/quote]

Maybe with Sansa. Still doesn't apply for Jamie raping his sister, Littlefinger, Varys and Tyrion being idiots.

[quote=BarryChuckle]Just to elaborate, a "fair trial" has never been part fo the books or show. There is no established legal system of "fair trials" in Westeros. . A (rigged) trial was afforded to Tyrion as a gesture due to his status, and as a way for Tywin to keep his hands clean from the perceived grievous sin of kinslaying.

Lords have the right to "pit and gallows" ie: can legally put anyone of lower feudal status within their lands to death, this has been established numerous times in the books, and was established in season one with Ned "passsing sentence" on a deserter. No trial.[/quote]

There was no trial because the dude literally confessed to being a deserter of the Nights Watch. If somebody is accused of something, and they deny it, there tends to be some kind of due process. Especially in a place like Winterfell.
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#30
1 Frags +
sheepy_dogs_handOmbrackYou can set a character in a given frame, and then make them evolve because of the things they have been through. I wasnt too surprised that Sansa became who she is now, because honestly who would stay the same after enduring so much shit.
Sansa had to deal with so much unfair events throughout the show, it's pretty fair for her to "give back" at some point. She's not the naive little maiden that she used to be, she toughen up, and seeks revenge, not justice.

Maybe with Sansa. Still doesn't apply for Jamie raping his sister, Littlefinger, Varys and Tyrion being idiots.

At that moment in the story, Jaime is back to King's Landing, after spending months in chains, in the mud, far from the life he had and the woman he loved. And when he's back, after fighting through dishonor and literal shit, he's only met with hatred, disregard and physical rejection (not to mention his first son just died). As he's trying to atone for his past acts, he now sees the foul side of Cersei, so as much as he loves her, he probably doesnt have as much respect/consideration for her as he used to have, and he too wants to get what he wants.
So again, this particular moment doesn't clash with the rest of his character, you just have to consider the characters aren't as one-dimensional as you seem to believe.

[quote=sheepy_dogs_hand][quote=Ombrack]You can set a character in a given frame, and then make them evolve because of the things they have been through. I wasnt too surprised that Sansa became who she is now, because honestly who would stay the same after enduring so much shit.
Sansa had to deal with so much unfair events throughout the show, it's pretty fair for her to "give back" at some point. She's not the naive little maiden that she used to be, she toughen up, and seeks revenge, not justice.[/quote]

Maybe with Sansa. Still doesn't apply for Jamie raping his sister, Littlefinger, Varys and Tyrion being idiots.

[/quote]

At that moment in the story, Jaime is back to King's Landing, after spending months in chains, in the mud, far from the life he had and the woman he loved. And when he's back, after fighting through dishonor and literal shit, he's only met with hatred, disregard and physical rejection (not to mention his first son just died). As he's trying to atone for his past acts, he now sees the foul side of Cersei, so as much as he loves her, he probably doesnt have as much respect/consideration for her as he used to have, and he too wants to get what he wants.
So again, this particular moment doesn't clash with the rest of his character, you just have to consider the characters aren't as one-dimensional as you seem to believe.
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