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Global Whitelist Lists Post-Meeting
1
#1
0 Frags +

The Rewind LAN whitelist: http://whitelist.tf/6769
Experimental PugChamp whitelist: http://whitelist.tf/6772

We decided to only ban weapons for the upcoming Rewind LAN to have minimal effect on the event.
We'll experiment in PugChamp with an experimental league list since matches start the week of the 22nd and we need time to playtest. Will run this by Erynn.

There's still room for a followup meeting should we need it prior to the start of league play. I'm sure there will be a lot of whitelist discussions at the Rewind LAN itself as well.

Changelist for Rewind LAN (list #6769)
Ban > Rescue Ranger
Ban > Jarate
Ban > Machina

Changelist for League Play (list #6772)
Ban > Rescue Ranger
Ban > Jarate
Unban > Sodapopper
Unban > Dalokohs Bar
Unban > Pomson 6000
Unban > Quick Fix
Unban > Solemn Vow

Meeting notes:
1. We won't be unbanning anything for the Rewind LAN because it could drastically change results due to the limited amount of time that teams have to prepare (less than one week). Players on both sides of the pond agreed that the rescue ranger and jarate were the worst offenders and needed to be banned regardless, at least for the time being.
2. We can always schedule a follow-up meeting but league play starts in a week so let's start experimenting now.
3. There are major issues regarding consistency of weapon bans. People wanted to ban the cow mangler simply because it was annoying (not game breaking) but couldn't apply the same logic to the natscha or the fan of war.
4. We should operate under the assumption that Valve won't give us major game balancing updates more than a few times per year.
5. We shouldn't make massive changes from the last global whitelist. Thus we proposed only 7 changes.
6. Tri specifically (ESEA) was against the quick fix and the solemn vow for reasons you guys have listed above. We agreed to a week of playtesting followed by a solid decision.

The Rewind LAN whitelist: http://whitelist.tf/6769
Experimental PugChamp whitelist: http://whitelist.tf/6772

We decided to only ban weapons for the upcoming Rewind LAN to have minimal effect on the event.
We'll experiment in PugChamp with an experimental league list since matches start the week of the 22nd and we need time to playtest. Will run this by Erynn.

There's still room for a followup meeting should we need it prior to the start of league play. I'm sure there will be a lot of whitelist discussions at the Rewind LAN itself as well.

[b]Changelist for Rewind LAN (list #6769)[/b]
Ban > Rescue Ranger
Ban > Jarate
Ban > Machina

[b]Changelist for League Play (list #6772)[/b]
Ban > Rescue Ranger
Ban > Jarate
Unban > Sodapopper
Unban > Dalokohs Bar
Unban > Pomson 6000
Unban > Quick Fix
Unban > Solemn Vow

Meeting notes:
1. We won't be unbanning anything for the Rewind LAN because it could drastically change results due to the limited amount of time that teams have to prepare (less than one week). Players on both sides of the pond agreed that the rescue ranger and jarate were the worst offenders and needed to be banned regardless, at least for the time being.
2. We can always schedule a follow-up meeting but league play starts in a week so let's start experimenting now.
3. There are major issues regarding consistency of weapon bans. People wanted to ban the cow mangler simply because it was annoying (not game breaking) but couldn't apply the same logic to the natscha or the fan of war.
4. We should operate under the assumption that Valve won't give us major game balancing updates more than a few times per year.
5. We shouldn't make massive changes from the last global whitelist. Thus we proposed only 7 changes.
6. Tri specifically (ESEA) was against the quick fix and the solemn vow for reasons you guys have listed above. We agreed to a week of playtesting followed by a solid decision.
2
#2
8 Frags +

happy mlk day slin

happy mlk day slin
3
#3
38 Frags +

I thought they agreed to ban the cow mangler I was so excited

I thought they agreed to ban the cow mangler I was so excited
4
#4
16 Frags +

why are jarate, machina, and rr allowed on pug champ? They got banned.

Honestly, rewind should be current whitelist and next season should be the rewind whitelist, if not more things banned. I don't understand why we're allowing weapons we're on the fence about. What's to gain?

why are jarate, machina, and rr allowed on pug champ? They got banned.

Honestly, rewind should be current whitelist and next season should be the rewind whitelist, if not more things banned. I don't understand why we're allowing weapons we're on the fence about. What's to gain?
5
#5
71 Frags +

why would you ban unlocks a week before a LAN

why would you ban unlocks a week before a LAN
6
#6
33 Frags +

I know its only gonna happen like once, but I'm gonna be so tilted when I get dropped pushing last cuz our med gets pomson'd for 1%

I know its only gonna happen like once, but I'm gonna be so tilted when I get dropped pushing last cuz our med gets pomson'd for 1%
7
#7
17 Frags +
Starkiewhy would you ban unlocks a week before a LAN

cause u kept owning that 1 team on viaduct with it and he argued heavily for it to be banned

[quote=Starkie]why would you ban unlocks a week before a LAN[/quote]
cause u kept owning that 1 team on viaduct with it and he argued heavily for it to be banned
8
#8
82 Frags +

unbanning the quick fix is the most retarded thing ive seen in a long time

unbanning the quick fix is the most retarded thing ive seen in a long time
9
#9
25 Frags +
Starkiewhy would you ban unlocks a week before a LAN

this and what is the logic behind allowing quick fix and solemon's vow

[quote=Starkie]why would you ban unlocks a week before a LAN[/quote]
this and what is the logic behind allowing quick fix and solemon's vow
10
#10
53 Frags +
T0munbanning the quick fix is the most retarded thing ive seen in a long time

b-but then maybe valve will be happy with us :)

:)

[quote=T0m]unbanning the quick fix is the most retarded thing ive seen in a long time[/quote]

b-but then maybe valve will be happy with us :)






:)
11
#11
17 Frags +

also why is slin the person in control of it he got cut he doesn't have to suffer through the ensuing aids (god forbid some mongo with a pomson shoots me once as im pushing through a choke point and deletes my uber)

also why is slin the person in control of it he got cut he doesn't have to suffer through the ensuing aids (god forbid some mongo with a pomson shoots me once as im pushing through a choke point and deletes my uber)
12
#12
-12 Frags +
Starkiewhy would you ban unlocks a week before a LAN

I'm not the tournament admin for the LAN, these are just our proposed changes after talking with TF2 league admins and high level players from around the world. I believe Samiface is the tournament admin for Rewind LAN.

Our thought process was that these two weapons are very overpowered and a significant portion of the competitive community doesn't like playing with them. We didn't want to make a potentially unexpected, significant change by unbanning something so we only banned two items. These two items have been hotly debated in the community throughout the season.

[quote=Starkie]why would you ban unlocks a week before a LAN[/quote]
I'm not the tournament admin for the LAN, these are just our proposed changes after talking with TF2 league admins and high level players from around the world. I believe Samiface is the tournament admin for Rewind LAN.

Our thought process was that these two weapons are very overpowered and a significant portion of the competitive community doesn't like playing with them. We didn't want to make a potentially unexpected, significant change by unbanning something so we only banned two items. These two items have been hotly debated in the community throughout the season.
13
#13
37 Frags +

oh shit i forgot now we will have 4 majors and an international my bad guys

oh shit i forgot now we will have 4 majors and an international my bad guys
14
#14
37 Frags +
CrayonT0munbanning the quick fix is the most retarded thing ive seen in a long time
b-but then maybe valve will be happy with us :)

:)

Every weapon we unban Valve give us a major with $2m prize pool

[quote=Crayon][quote=T0m]unbanning the quick fix is the most retarded thing ive seen in a long time[/quote]

b-but then maybe valve will be happy with us :)

:)[/quote]
Every weapon we unban Valve give us a major with $2m prize pool
15
#15
68 Frags +
Starkiewhy would you ban unlocks a week before a LAN

why weren't you at the meeting

bearodactylalso why is slin the person in control of it he got cut he doesn't have to suffer through the ensuing aids (god forbid some mongo with a pomson shoots me once as im pushing through a choke point and deletes my uber

he's not in charge of it he's just the only one willing to make a meeting happen

[quote=Starkie]why would you ban unlocks a week before a LAN[/quote]

why weren't you at the meeting

[quote=bearodactyl]also why is slin the person in control of it he got cut he doesn't have to suffer through the ensuing aids (god forbid some mongo with a pomson shoots me once as im pushing through a choke point and deletes my uber[/quote]

he's not in charge of it he's just the only one willing to make a meeting happen
16
#16
11 Frags +

damn i love majors

damn i love majors
17
#17
-9 Frags +
knuckStarkiewhy would you ban unlocks a week before a LAN
why weren't you at the meeting
bearodactylalso why is slin the person in control of it he got cut he doesn't have to suffer through the ensuing aids (god forbid some mongo with a pomson shoots me once as im pushing through a choke point and deletes my uber
he's not in charge of it he's just the only one willing to make a meeting happen

believe it or not some people have lives and or don't want to sit in a mumble with a hundred sweaty retards arguing about which stupid unlock to unban this time

[quote=knuck][quote=Starkie]why would you ban unlocks a week before a LAN[/quote]

why weren't you at the meeting

[quote=bearodactyl]also why is slin the person in control of it he got cut he doesn't have to suffer through the ensuing aids (god forbid some mongo with a pomson shoots me once as im pushing through a choke point and deletes my uber[/quote]

he's not in charge of it he's just the only one willing to make a meeting happen[/quote]
believe it or not some people have lives and or don't want to sit in a mumble with a hundred sweaty retards arguing about which stupid unlock to unban this time
18
#18
0 Frags +

incoming tf2 international

incoming tf2 international
19
#19
31 Frags +
knuckStarkiewhy would you ban unlocks a week before a LAN
why weren't you at the meeting

his cat shit on his mail and he was cleaning it up

[quote=knuck][quote=Starkie]why would you ban unlocks a week before a LAN[/quote]

why weren't you at the meeting[/quote]
his cat shit on his mail and he was cleaning it up
20
#20
0 Frags +

if u don't attend the meeting then don't complain when unlocks that most people wanted banned anyways are banned eh?

if u don't attend the meeting then don't complain when unlocks that most people wanted banned anyways are banned eh?
21
#21
10 Frags +
knuckStarkiewhy would you ban unlocks a week before a LAN
why weren't you at the meeting
bearodactylalso why is slin the person in control of it he got cut he doesn't have to suffer through the ensuing aids (god forbid some mongo with a pomson shoots me once as im pushing through a choke point and deletes my uber
he's not in charge of it he's just the only one willing to make a meeting happen

why do we need a meeting idgi. I don't understand why we need to open up the whitelist at all, who are we trying to please? It's like we're making these changes under the ideology of valve giving more support, but at the expense of those actually playing at the time. As someone who plays the game recreationally I want to enjoy the game now, not suffer through a year of awful whitelists planning ahead for the future.

[quote=knuck][quote=Starkie]why would you ban unlocks a week before a LAN[/quote]

why weren't you at the meeting

[quote=bearodactyl]also why is slin the person in control of it he got cut he doesn't have to suffer through the ensuing aids (god forbid some mongo with a pomson shoots me once as im pushing through a choke point and deletes my uber[/quote]

he's not in charge of it he's just the only one willing to make a meeting happen[/quote]

why do we need a meeting idgi. I don't understand why we need to open up the whitelist at all, who are we trying to please? It's like we're making these changes under the ideology of valve giving more support, but at the expense of those actually playing at the time. As someone who plays the game recreationally I want to enjoy the game now, not suffer through a year of awful whitelists planning ahead for the future.
22
#22
44 Frags +
rocketslayif u don't attend the meeting then don't complain when unlocks that most people wanted banned anyways are banned eh?

im not complaining that theyre banned, im complaining that theyre banned so close to the tournament

[quote=rocketslay]if u don't attend the meeting then don't complain when unlocks that most people wanted banned anyways are banned eh?[/quote]
im not complaining that theyre banned, im complaining that theyre banned so close to the tournament
23
#23
15 Frags +

No stark lobbin a kaidus-coordinated jarate set smoke onto nursey :/

No stark lobbin a kaidus-coordinated jarate set smoke onto nursey :/
24
#24
-26 Frags +

Crayon the purpose of the meeting was to discuss unbans AND bans. Don't be so narrow minded.

Crayon the purpose of the meeting was to discuss unbans AND bans. Don't be so narrow minded.
25
#25
21 Frags +

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OalWDhYfdeg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OalWDhYfdeg
26
#26
-24 Frags +
FFyghttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OalWDhYfdeg

I casted that LAN and was one of the people complaining. The worst part about the weapon was that it got changed mid-season so it messed everything up. We've had a chance to take a look at the weapon in the off-season so this isn't the same situation.

[quote=FFyg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OalWDhYfdeg[/quote]
I casted that LAN and was one of the people complaining. The worst part about the weapon was that it got changed mid-season so it messed everything up. We've had a chance to take a look at the weapon in the off-season so this isn't the same situation.
27
#27
25 Frags +

i can't wait to play against scouts with 5 jumps and flying medics

i can't wait to play against scouts with 5 jumps and flying medics
28
#28
18 Frags +

soda popper+winger to make pugs even more aids

soda popper+winger to make pugs even more aids
29
#29
40 Frags +
MR_SLINFFyghttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OalWDhYfdegI casted that LAN and was one of the people complaining. The worst part about the weapon was that it got changed mid-season so it messed everything up. We've had a chance to take a look at the weapon in the off-season so this isn't the same situation.

DownFraggeD

[quote=MR_SLIN][quote=FFyg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OalWDhYfdeg[/quote]
I casted that LAN and was one of the people complaining. The worst part about the weapon was that it got changed mid-season so it messed everything up. We've had a chance to take a look at the weapon in the off-season so this isn't the same situation.[/quote]
DownFraggeD
30
#30
16 Frags +

What's the matter with discussing it on the forums so that people who weren't there have a say in things? Did you not set out to 'include the entire community'?
Don't get me wrong, as a medic main i think unbanning the quick fix and solemon vow is going to be fun af but the question is will be for the better good of the game? Or do I not get a say in things cause I was busy visiting with family and couldn't make the meeting?

What's the matter with discussing it on the forums so that people who weren't there have a say in things? Did you not set out to 'include the entire community'?
Don't get me wrong, as a medic main i think unbanning the quick fix and solemon vow is going to be fun af but the question is will be for the better good of the game? Or do I not get a say in things cause I was busy visiting with family and couldn't make the meeting?
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