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Regarding ESL (Play) and ESEA
1
#1
0 Frags +

There seems to be a bit of confusion regarding mitch's statement regarding ESL Play and a possible upcoming league through the service.

First, it's best to get the elephant in the room out of the way. While mitch is a league admin for ESL Play's TF2 division, he is not an employee of ESL (in regards to their ESL Play division) nor does he necessarily have massive influence on the direction of ESL Play's expansion into TF2 — at least to my knowledge. While I've been told by mitch that plans are currently underway to start a league, and I trust that he's relaying this information in good faith, his word is not final.

Secondly, ESL Play and ESL (i.e. ESL Pro League, ESL One) are basically semi-autonomous entities in relation to their connection and influence. ESL's event organizing division will usually use ESL Play for said event's qualifiers, but a game being on ESL Play does not automatically segue the game into a possible LAN event. ESL Play's actions have little impact on the actions of their live event organizers.

Thirdly, ESL does own ESEA, yes. However, it's important to understand why ESL acquired the league in the first place. ESEA was acquired by ESL in late 2015 as an investment in the rapidly expanding CS:GO competitive scene. ESEA had not only the largest CS:GO league in the world, but also the largest paid pug system, and a professional division (Invite). After the acquisition, Invite was folded into ESL ESEA Pro League and TF2 was dumped as a result. It's also important to note that ESL Play likely has little-to-no influence or authority regarding ESEA's actions or administration.

This is not to say that ESL Play expanding into TF2 is a bad thing; I'm excited to see what might come out of this. I just wanted to clear up some wrong assumptions I've been seeing here and on Twitch.

There seems to be a bit of confusion regarding mitch's statement regarding ESL Play and a possible upcoming league through the service.

First, it's best to get the elephant in the room out of the way. While mitch is a league admin for ESL Play's TF2 division, he is not an employee of ESL (in regards to their ESL Play division) nor does he necessarily have massive influence on the direction of ESL Play's expansion into TF2 — at least to my knowledge. While I've been told by mitch that plans are currently underway to start a league, and I trust that he's relaying this information in good faith, his word is not final.

Secondly, ESL Play and ESL (i.e. ESL Pro League, ESL One) are basically semi-autonomous entities in relation to their connection and influence. ESL's event organizing division will usually use ESL Play for said event's qualifiers, but a game being on ESL Play does not automatically segue the game into a possible LAN event. ESL Play's actions have little impact on the actions of their live event organizers.

Thirdly, ESL does own ESEA, yes. However, it's important to understand why ESL acquired the league in the first place. ESEA was acquired by ESL in late 2015 as an investment in the rapidly expanding CS:GO competitive scene. ESEA had not only the largest CS:GO league in the world, but also the largest paid pug system, and a professional division (Invite). After the acquisition, Invite was folded into ESL ESEA Pro League and TF2 was dumped as a result. It's also important to note that ESL Play likely has little-to-no influence or authority regarding ESEA's actions or administration.

This is not to say that ESL Play expanding into TF2 is a bad thing; I'm excited to see what might come out of this. I just wanted to clear up some wrong assumptions I've been seeing here and on Twitch.
2
#2
15 Frags +

IEM TF2 major pog

IEM TF2 major pog
3
#3
8 Frags +

If ESEA dropped TF2 because it was losing them money, and ESL owns ESEA, for what purpose would ESL want to branch into TF2?

If ESEA dropped TF2 because it was losing them money, and ESL owns ESEA, for what purpose would ESL want to branch into TF2?
4
#4
19 Frags +
whitepuzzleIf ESEA dropped TF2 because it was losing them money, and ESL owns ESEA, for what purpose would ESL want to branch into TF2?

The reason why ESEA dropped TF2 wasn't because they were losing money; Premium Fees + League Fees likely gave them a slight profit with TF2. ESEA dropped TF2 because the game's league wasn't growing and because "TF2 only comprised of 1% of ESEA's population and the resources put into the game could be instead put into CS:GO and thus impact a greater number of people." Essentially ESEA sought to centralise its resources into CS:GO and TF2's low rate of return just made the game a tumour that ESEA put off cutting.

ESL Play, in comparison, is much broader and much more open in its catalogue of games, which includes over 25 at the moment. It's much easier for ESL Play to branch into TF2 because its backend is more flexible and because their structure is more oriented towards different games rather than just CS:GO and CS:GO alone.

[quote=whitepuzzle]If ESEA dropped TF2 because it was losing them money, and ESL owns ESEA, for what purpose would ESL want to branch into TF2?[/quote]

The reason why ESEA dropped TF2 wasn't because they were losing money; Premium Fees + League Fees likely gave them a slight profit with TF2. ESEA dropped TF2 because the game's league wasn't growing and because "TF2 only comprised of 1% of ESEA's population and the resources put into the game could be instead put into CS:GO and thus impact a greater number of people." Essentially ESEA sought to centralise its resources into CS:GO and TF2's low rate of return just made the game a tumour that ESEA put off cutting.

ESL Play, in comparison, is much broader and much more open in its catalogue of games, which includes over 25 at the moment. It's much easier for ESL Play to branch into TF2 because its backend is more flexible and because their structure is more oriented towards different games rather than just CS:GO and CS:GO alone.
5
#5
15 Frags +
bleghfarec ESEA was acquired by ESEA
[quote=bleghfarec] ESEA was acquired by ESEA [/quote]
6
#6
ESL Play
31 Frags +

I would like to add onto what bleghfarec said in relationship to ESL owning ESEA.This is a misconception that was made by media. Turtle Entertainment owns ESL and ESEA, not ESL owning ESEA. I can't simply go and administrate TF2 at ESEA, neither can my manager or his manager. We are two seperate running entities.

I would like to add onto what bleghfarec said in relationship to ESL owning ESEA.This is a misconception that was made by media. Turtle Entertainment owns ESL and ESEA, not ESL owning ESEA. I can't simply go and administrate TF2 at ESEA, neither can my manager or his manager. We are two seperate running entities.
7
#7
0 Frags +

How many ESEA LANs were there per year? If it's 1 or 2, using LANs like rewind as unofficial substitutes could be a solution

How many ESEA LANs were there per year? If it's 1 or 2, using LANs like rewind as unofficial substitutes could be a solution
8
#8
0 Frags +
TwiggyHow many ESEA LANs were there per year? If it's 1 or 2, using LANs like rewind as unofficial substitutes could be a solution

There hasnt been TF2 at ESEA LAN in two years I think

[quote=Twiggy]How many ESEA LANs were there per year? If it's 1 or 2, using LANs like rewind as unofficial substitutes could be a solution[/quote]
There hasnt been TF2 at ESEA LAN in two years I think
9
#9
6 Frags +
bleghfarecwhitepuzzle
The reason why ESEA dropped TF2 wasn't because they were losing money; Premium Fees + League Fees likely gave them a slight profit with TF2.

"For the last several seasons ESEA has continually contributed significantly more to the TF2 prize pool than what is naturally generated by the League fees"

and you count labour in your profits - admin and dev salaries are active costs put into the game. it's pretty clear they've been making a loss for a while

[quote=bleghfarec][quote=whitepuzzle][/quote]

The reason why ESEA dropped TF2 wasn't because they were losing money; Premium Fees + League Fees likely gave them a slight profit with TF2. [/quote]

"For the last several seasons ESEA has continually contributed significantly more to the TF2 prize pool than what is naturally generated by the League fees"

and you count labour in your profits - admin and dev salaries are active costs put into the game. it's pretty clear they've been making a loss for a while
10
#10
17 Frags +

Can you guys stop assuming esl is going to run it? All they said is they're considering it and you guys are already talking about LANs and stuff. Just let them figure out what they can viably do without giving them a wishlist of everything we've wanted for the past 3 years.

Can you guys stop assuming esl is going to run it? All they said is they're considering it and you guys are already talking about LANs and stuff. Just let them figure out what they can viably do without giving them a wishlist of everything we've wanted for the past 3 years.
11
#11
6 Frags +
ShooshThere hasnt been TF2 at ESEA LAN in two years I think

tomorrow will be exactly 4 years since last TF2 ESEA Lan (S18)
also that wasnt his question bro it was how many lans per year (it was 3 btw)

[quote=Shoosh]
There hasnt been TF2 at ESEA LAN in two years I think[/quote]
tomorrow will be exactly 4 years since last TF2 ESEA Lan (S18)
also that wasnt his question bro it was how many lans per year (it was 3 btw)
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