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witch hunts within the community
posted in The Dumpster
61
#61
4 Frags +

does this thread really need to exist

does this thread really need to exist
62
#62
-2 Frags +
dishsoaphey morons. if u dont want to be witch hunted, dont be/say anything that would make u seem islamophobic, anti-semitic, racist, homophobic, transphobic, misogynistic, etc.

problem solved have a good day, and remember, hate speech != free speech

This statement is super ignorant, although I suspect you are probably just parroting somebody else's talking point. The idea you have neat binary classifications of 'Free Speech' and 'Hate Speech' is absurd.

Free Speech is actually a big issue of our times. It generally refers to an individual's right not to face government sanction for their speech. In the US you actually have your freedom of speech protected by the first amendment. In the EU we have a considerably watered down protection of free speech, which is why government was able to pass Hate Speech legislation in the UK.

The reason 'Hate speech' is highly controversial is because it is ill-defined and highly subjective. Most things people would regard as Hate Speech are actually protected as free speech in the US. Of course ETF2L or any other league/website isn't a government body so is under no obligation to protect an individual's free speech. It is up to ETF2L how much they want to police people's speech on their platform, but most online platforms prohibit discriminatory speech and behaviour in their T&Cs.

[quote=dishsoap]hey morons. if u dont want to be witch hunted, dont be/say anything that would make u seem islamophobic, anti-semitic, racist, homophobic, transphobic, misogynistic, etc.

problem solved have a good day, and remember, hate speech != free speech[/quote]

This statement is super ignorant, although I suspect you are probably just parroting somebody else's talking point. The idea you have neat binary classifications of 'Free Speech' and 'Hate Speech' is absurd.

Free Speech is actually a big issue of our times. It generally refers to an individual's right not to face government sanction for their speech. In the US you actually have your freedom of speech protected by the first amendment. In the EU we have a considerably watered down protection of free speech, which is why government was able to pass Hate Speech legislation in the UK.

The reason 'Hate speech' is highly controversial is because it is ill-defined and highly subjective. Most things people would regard as Hate Speech are actually protected as free speech in the US. Of course ETF2L or any other league/website isn't a government body so is under no obligation to protect an individual's free speech. It is up to ETF2L how much they want to police people's speech on their platform, but most online platforms prohibit discriminatory speech and behaviour in their T&Cs.
63
#63
29 Frags +

chill, good dm

chill, good dm
64
#64
-34 Frags +

I have no idea where this post has actually gone, I'm pretty sure it's original intention has gone out of the window. What stuns me is the misinformation being spread. If you're going to accuse someone of sexism or homophobia, maybe don't accuse the notoriously leftist ''sjw'' LGBT+ TF2 Player.(though flight accusing ME of being homophobic was VERY funny). First time for everything, I guess.

I don't really understand the original intention of this post anyhow, it seems to be more people complaining that ''I did something wrong, now I'm being punished'' + some mega misinformation about myself (even though it isn't really relevant to the topic at hand).

The comment I was going to post last night, but held back on.

I have no idea where this post has actually gone, I'm pretty sure it's original intention has gone out of the window. What stuns me is the misinformation being spread. If you're going to accuse someone of sexism or homophobia, maybe don't accuse the notoriously leftist ''sjw'' LGBT+ TF2 Player.[url=https://twitter.com/FLIGHTthecool/status/1049034487923965952](though flight accusing ME of being homophobic was VERY funny).[/url] First time for everything, I guess.

I don't really understand the original intention of this post anyhow, it seems to be more people complaining that ''I did something wrong, now I'm being punished'' + some mega misinformation about myself (even though it isn't really relevant to the topic at hand).
[url=https://imgur.com/a/MxqODMs]
The comment I was going to post last night, but held back on.[/url]
65
#65
2 Frags +
CronkAlso, more or less known members of the community voicing their opinions is a non-issue.
Etf2l not explaining their reasoning behind bans has nothing to do with individuals expressing their thoughts. If etf2l actually provided the public with at least some information, or their reasoning behind the bans, posts like these wouldn't be necessary.

I agree that it is a non-issue if youre only concerned about getting banned on etf2l, but let alone being called out by some well known people within the community you like and thus having your reputation kinda destroyed still sucks alot and might even be a bigger issue than just being banned from a league.

Witch hunting should be just as much of a bannable offense.

[quote=Cronk]
Also, more or less known members of the community voicing their opinions is a non-issue.
Etf2l not explaining their reasoning behind bans has nothing to do with individuals expressing their thoughts. If etf2l actually provided the public with at least some information, or their reasoning behind the bans, posts like these wouldn't be necessary.[/quote]
I agree that it is a non-issue if youre only concerned about getting banned on etf2l, but let alone being called out by some well known people within the community you like and thus having your reputation kinda destroyed still sucks alot and might even be a bigger issue than just being banned from a league.

Witch hunting should be just as much of a bannable offense.
66
#66
-10 Frags +
FireCronkAlso, more or less known members of the community voicing their opinions is a non-issue.
Etf2l not explaining their reasoning behind bans has nothing to do with individuals expressing their thoughts. If etf2l actually provided the public with at least some information, or their reasoning behind the bans, posts like these wouldn't be necessary.
I agree that it is a non-issue if youre only concerned about getting banned on etf2l, but let alone being called out by some well known people within the community you like and thus having your reputation kinda destroyed still sucks alot and might even be a bigger issue than just being banned from a league.

Witch hunting should be just as much of a bannable offense.

I totally agree with what you're saying here, but I really don't understand why I (as a ''more well known'' person in the community) are being accused of witch-hunting? I literally posted a screenshot of the ban on Twitter and said that I was proud to see a change being made to the toxicity that runs rampant in this community. I don't see how that is a witch-hunt?

(something more akin to a witch-hunt would be messy/flight's friends jumping into my twitch-chat.)

[quote=Fire][quote=Cronk]
Also, more or less known members of the community voicing their opinions is a non-issue.
Etf2l not explaining their reasoning behind bans has nothing to do with individuals expressing their thoughts. If etf2l actually provided the public with at least some information, or their reasoning behind the bans, posts like these wouldn't be necessary.[/quote]
I agree that it is a non-issue if youre only concerned about getting banned on etf2l, but let alone being called out by some well known people within the community you like and thus having your reputation kinda destroyed still sucks alot and might even be a bigger issue than just being banned from a league.

Witch hunting should be just as much of a bannable offense.[/quote]

I totally agree with what you're saying here, but I really don't understand why I (as a ''more well known'' person in the community) are being accused of witch-hunting? I literally posted a screenshot of the ban on Twitter and said that I was proud to see a change being made to the toxicity that runs rampant in this community. I don't see how that is a witch-hunt?

[url=https://imgur.com/a/ijEnvgQ](something more akin to a witch-hunt would be messy/flight's friends jumping into my twitch-chat.) [/url]
67
#67
0 Frags +
DoomsdayexeI have no idea where this post has actually gone, I'm pretty sure it's original intention has gone out of the window. What stuns me is the misinformation being spread. If you're going to accuse someone of sexism or homophobia, maybe don't accuse the notoriously leftist ''sjw'' LGBT+ TF2 Player.(though flight accusing ME of being homophobic was VERY funny). First time for everything, I guess.

I don't really understand the original intention of this post anyhow, it seems to be more people complaining that ''I did something wrong, now I'm being punished'' + some mega misinformation about myself (even though it isn't really relevant to the topic at hand).

The comment I was going to post last night, but held back on.

For the third time I wasn't calling you homophobic. You praised National being banned for the blue bunny champ video but then make a video on a serious topic.

[quote=Doomsdayexe]I have no idea where this post has actually gone, I'm pretty sure it's original intention has gone out of the window. What stuns me is the misinformation being spread. If you're going to accuse someone of sexism or homophobia, maybe don't accuse the notoriously leftist ''sjw'' LGBT+ TF2 Player.[url=https://twitter.com/FLIGHTthecool/status/1049034487923965952](though flight accusing ME of being homophobic was VERY funny).[/url] First time for everything, I guess.

I don't really understand the original intention of this post anyhow, it seems to be more people complaining that ''I did something wrong, now I'm being punished'' + some mega misinformation about myself (even though it isn't really relevant to the topic at hand).
[url=https://imgur.com/a/MxqODMs]
The comment I was going to post last night, but held back on.[/url][/quote]
For the third time I wasn't calling you homophobic. You praised National being banned for the blue bunny champ video but then make a video on a serious topic.
68
#68
33 Frags +

The original intention of this thread is that people shouldn't be witch-hunted. Which I think is perfectly reasonable thing to request. Ironic because I outed arekk out pretty badly (which I still do kinda feel bad about). Witch hunting is not the best way to handle things, banning and moving on would be good enough. It causes unnecessary drama and when the punishments are already handed, it doesn't add anything. Just adds flame to a fire. Adding another wrong to another may feel sweet, but it's purely for feeling. It's not a good way to handle things, and I think people claiming that it's wrong are perfectly right in claiming that.

The only dumb thing would be those trying to defend their 'right' to act like assholes. If you can't find enjoyment from the game unless you bring in slurs, at least do some sort of mature thing in your life and take your punishment instead of crying about not playing the game for a month or two. I don't know what the creator of this thread was punished for really, and I don't care enough to really dig up about it. I'm not claiming your someone of the sort I just mentioned. I think you're in the right place claiming witch-hunting is wrong, but anything beyond that is just stretching too far. As was pretty much said by tagg, if people are acting like trash, they should be taken out like trash.

The original intention of this thread is that people shouldn't be witch-hunted. Which I think is perfectly reasonable thing to request. Ironic because I outed arekk out pretty badly (which I still do kinda feel bad about). Witch hunting is not the best way to handle things, banning and moving on would be good enough. It causes unnecessary drama and when the punishments are already handed, it doesn't add anything. Just adds flame to a fire. Adding another wrong to another may feel sweet, but it's purely for feeling. It's not a good way to handle things, and I think people claiming that it's wrong are perfectly right in claiming that.

The only dumb thing would be those trying to defend their 'right' to act like assholes. If you can't find enjoyment from the game unless you bring in slurs, at least do some sort of mature thing in your life and take your punishment instead of crying about not playing the game for a month or two. I don't know what the creator of this thread was punished for really, and I don't care enough to really dig up about it. I'm not claiming your someone of the sort I just mentioned. I think you're in the right place claiming witch-hunting is wrong, but anything beyond that is just stretching too far. As was pretty much said by tagg, if people are acting like trash, they should be taken out like trash.
69
#69
0 Frags +
DoomsdayexeFire
I totally agree with what you're saying here, but I really don't understand why I (as a ''more well known'' person in the community) are being accused of witch-hunting? I literally posted a screenshot of the ban on Twitter and said that I was proud to see a change being made to the toxicity that runs rampant in this community. I don't see how that is a witch-hunt?

(something more akin to a witch-hunt would be messy/flight's friends jumping into my twitch-chat.)

idk if you just quoted me to agree with my post, but i never said anything about you or any other person in particular.
my post was just directed at witch hunting in general.

[quote=Doomsdayexe][quote=Fire][/quote]

I totally agree with what you're saying here, but I really don't understand why I (as a ''more well known'' person in the community) are being accused of witch-hunting? I literally posted a screenshot of the ban on Twitter and said that I was proud to see a change being made to the toxicity that runs rampant in this community. I don't see how that is a witch-hunt?

[url=https://imgur.com/a/ijEnvgQ](something more akin to a witch-hunt would be messy/flight's friends jumping into my twitch-chat.) [/url][/quote]
idk if you just quoted me to agree with my post, but i never said anything about you or any other person in particular.
my post was just directed at witch hunting in general.
70
#70
18 Frags +
messymystlThe name ‘jew in oven’ is offensive even if the person with the name is jewish. That argument makes no sense.sure but you, as someone not part of that group, do not reserve the right to being upset at the joke. if you get angry FOR the group that someone who's a member of that group make jokes on, you're incredibly entitled.

If you really believe in that I don't think your ban should be reconsidered tbh

[quote=messy][quote=mystl]The name ‘jew in oven’ is offensive even if the person with the name is jewish. That argument makes no sense.[/quote]
sure but you, as someone not part of that group, do not reserve the right to being upset at the joke. if you get angry FOR the group that someone who's a member of that group make jokes on, you're incredibly entitled.[/quote]
If you really believe in that I don't think your ban should be reconsidered tbh
71
#71
4 Frags +

You can avoid saying discriminatory, hateful or 'ist' behaviours while being concerned with the possibility of community figures using power as a bully pulpit or for settling scores. Mccarthyism is the type of outcome everyone should wish to avoid.

This is in part why it is important that there be some kind of procedure for making allegations under the guise of organisations (wherever reasonably possible).

You can avoid saying discriminatory, hateful or 'ist' behaviours while being concerned with the possibility of community figures using power as a bully pulpit or for settling scores. Mccarthyism is the type of outcome everyone should wish to avoid.

This is in part why it is important that there be some kind of procedure for making allegations under the guise of organisations (wherever reasonably possible).
72
#72
14 Frags +

"WAAAAAAH WAAAAAAH I CANT DO BULLSHIT WITHOUT THERE BEING CONSEQUENCES WAAAAAAH WAAAAAAH"

Man if you're that salty that you can't handle life without officials for a few weeks and have to make prolonged "efforts" to justify your stupidity then frankly we have nothing genuine to say to you. But hey you at least you found something productive to do until your bans are over right, keep at this rate and you shouldn't have to wait too long to play again. Just don't cry again if you haven't learned anything during this period and get banned again.

http://blog.caesars.com/las-vegas//wp-content/uploads/2010/05/two_cents.jpg

"WAAAAAAH WAAAAAAH I CANT DO BULLSHIT WITHOUT THERE BEING CONSEQUENCES WAAAAAAH WAAAAAAH"

Man if you're that salty that you can't handle life without officials for a few weeks and have to make prolonged "efforts" to justify your stupidity then frankly we have nothing genuine to say to you. But hey you at least you found something productive to do until your bans are over right, keep at this rate and you shouldn't have to wait too long to play again. Just don't cry again if you haven't learned anything during this period and get banned again.

[img]http://blog.caesars.com/las-vegas//wp-content/uploads/2010/05/two_cents.jpg[/img]
73
#73
10 Frags +
Wandumheres a pic of heny wanting to help doxx people for having different opinions
https://i.imgur.com/IPAi7Fj.png
really makes u think

this is unrelated to the tf2 players in this thread, but "having different opinions" is a very friendly take on the people in this picture

these guys were at the second unite the right rally which was the sequel to the original unite the right rally which took place in charlottesville, and was organised by the same guy, Jason Kessler (who is a neo nazi)

now, I would say that holding a kekistan flag at a fucking nazi rally might be an indication of your political beliefs, and even when questioned (near the end of the clip https://twitter.com/Awsumgrrl/status/1028834363448782848) they couldn't even admit to it and just said they were there "for jokes" and "to mess with people"..... normally I would say that doxxing people for having different opinions is bad, but when your "different opinion" is that you are a nazi, then you pretty much deserve everything that you get

[quote=Wandum]heres a pic of heny wanting to help doxx people for having different opinions
[img]https://i.imgur.com/IPAi7Fj.png[/img]
really makes u think[/quote]

this is unrelated to the tf2 players in this thread, but "having different opinions" is a very friendly take on the people in this picture

these guys were at the [url=https://www.thedailybeast.com/jason-kessler-white-nationalists-leaders-sneak-out-of-their-own-dc-rally]second unite the right rally[/url] which was the sequel to the original unite the right rally which took place in charlottesville, and was organised by the same guy, Jason Kessler (who is a neo nazi)

now, I would say that holding a kekistan flag at a fucking nazi rally might be an indication of your political beliefs, and even when questioned (near the end of the clip https://twitter.com/Awsumgrrl/status/1028834363448782848) they couldn't even admit to it and just said they were there "for jokes" and "to mess with people"..... normally I would say that doxxing people for having different opinions is bad, but when your "different opinion" is that you are a nazi, then you pretty much deserve everything that you get
74
#74
7 Frags +

#74
doing something immoral isn't suddenly moral when you do it to immoral people, you are not the police
also holding a kekistan flag would just be an indication that they are 4chan /pol/ memers to me, but i won't be the judge of that

#74
doing something immoral isn't suddenly moral when you do it to immoral people, you are not the police
also holding a kekistan flag would just be an indication that they are 4chan /pol/ memers to me, but i won't be the judge of that
75
#75
18 Frags +

remember when germans ran etf2l

remember when germans ran etf2l
76
#76
5 Frags +

it's better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt

it's better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt
77
#77
5 Frags +

its a ten from len

its a ten from len
78
#78
21 Frags +

Do u guys ever squeeze ur balls when ur peeing to make it go faster

- posted from my iPhone

Do u guys ever squeeze ur balls when ur peeing to make it go faster

- posted from my iPhone
79
#79
6 Frags +

Hey guys, what happens at the end of Catcher in the Rye? I have to read it for Honors English by tommorow

Hey guys, what happens at the end of Catcher in the Rye? I have to read it for Honors English by tommorow
80
#80
8 Frags +
FireCronkAlso, more or less known members of the community voicing their opinions is a non-issue.
Etf2l not explaining their reasoning behind bans has nothing to do with individuals expressing their thoughts. If etf2l actually provided the public with at least some information, or their reasoning behind the bans, posts like these wouldn't be necessary.
I agree that it is a non-issue if youre only concerned about getting banned on etf2l, but let alone being called out by some well known people within the community you like and thus having your reputation kinda destroyed still sucks alot and might even be a bigger issue than just being banned from a league.

Witch hunting should be just as much of a bannable offense.

If people are upset about the etf2l rules and a "slippery slope" effect, creating a ruleset for witch hunting is 100 times worse. Please define a bannable definition of witch hunting, where the line is drawn for what's bannable and what isn't. A really good example is this is r/globaloffensive where the mods remove all posts regarding cheating of high-level players without a VAC/ESEA/FACEIT ban, while blatantly cheating, do you really want that?

[quote=Fire][quote=Cronk]
Also, more or less known members of the community voicing their opinions is a non-issue.
Etf2l not explaining their reasoning behind bans has nothing to do with individuals expressing their thoughts. If etf2l actually provided the public with at least some information, or their reasoning behind the bans, posts like these wouldn't be necessary.[/quote]
I agree that it is a non-issue if youre only concerned about getting banned on etf2l, but let alone being called out by some well known people within the community you like and thus having your reputation kinda destroyed still sucks alot and might even be a bigger issue than just being banned from a league.

Witch hunting should be just as much of a bannable offense.[/quote]

If people are upset about the etf2l rules and a "slippery slope" effect, creating a ruleset for witch hunting is 100 times worse. Please define a bannable definition of witch hunting, where the line is drawn for what's bannable and what isn't. A really good example is this is r/globaloffensive where the mods remove all posts regarding cheating of high-level players without a VAC/ESEA/FACEIT ban, while blatantly cheating, do you really want that?
81
#81
4 Frags +

Publicly claiming someone is saying racist slurs when it later shows that that wasnt true would be a good first step.
In general publicly claiming someone did some bannable offense when it turns out afterwards that it wasnt true would be another good step.

Publicly claiming someone is saying racist slurs when it later shows that that wasnt true would be a good first step.
In general publicly claiming someone did some bannable offense when it turns out afterwards that it wasnt true would be another good step.
82
#82
6 Frags +
quantum#74
doing something immoral isn't suddenly moral when you do it to immoral people, you are not the police
...

why is this getting downvoted? he is telling some essential truth.

[quote=quantum]#74
doing something immoral isn't suddenly moral when you do it to immoral people, you are not the police
...[/quote]
why is this getting downvoted? he is telling some essential truth.
83
#83
7 Frags +

this thread is filled with double standards

this thread is filled with double standards
84
#84
-4 Frags +

am i the only one who felt fucking jebaited by watching the WHOLE liverpool v man city match yesterday? i dont even have sky so i had to leave my damn house to watch 90 minutes of that garbage disappointment

am i the only one who felt fucking jebaited by watching the WHOLE liverpool v man city match yesterday? i dont even have sky so i had to leave my damn house to watch 90 minutes of that garbage disappointment
85
#85
2 Frags +
alphaaquantum#74
doing something immoral isn't suddenly moral when you do it to immoral people, you are not the police
...
why is this getting downvoted? he is telling some essential truth.

The post is not saying we shouldn't be banned for hate speech, we're saying that players are using false claims to try victimise them selves and ban members for no reason

[quote=alphaa][quote=quantum]#74
doing something immoral isn't suddenly moral when you do it to immoral people, you are not the police
...[/quote]
why is this getting downvoted? he is telling some essential truth.[/quote]
The post is not saying we shouldn't be banned for hate speech, we're saying that players are using false claims to try victimise them selves and ban members for no reason
86
#86
1 Frags +

i think he was referring to with hunts. thats why i was wondering

i think he was referring to with hunts. thats why i was wondering
87
#87
-20 Frags +

honestly, this stuff makes me wanna shid and cammed in my pants.

honestly, this stuff makes me wanna shid and cammed in my pants.
88
#88
0 Frags +

since we are talking about witch hunting, can I remind you people that the person bluebunny has been super obnoxious, and blaming her mistakes on others without reason, and going to admins to report people on stuff that she did herself at a way higher degree. I mean, you don't get people to meme on you without a reason.. and you should take a closer look at the very start of things. When you are done with that, meet me at the stake restaurant.

since we are talking about witch hunting, can I remind you people that the person bluebunny has been super obnoxious, and blaming her mistakes on others without reason, and going to admins to report people on stuff that she did herself at a way higher degree. I mean, you don't get people to meme on you without a reason.. and you should take a closer look at the very start of things. When you are done with that, meet me at the stake restaurant.
89
#89
16 Frags +

The comment I was going to post last night, but held back on.

[url=https://i.gyazo.com/822f49783628ce26f1e544eea24e9734.png]The comment I was going to post last night, but held back on.[/url]
90
#90
13 Frags +

just like ruwin said (god bless his soul) the fucking cancer of this game is the vocal minority.
Doomsday.exe please leave this game along with your cringey channel and your 9 year old audience no one likes you LEAVE

just like ruwin said (god bless his soul) the fucking cancer of this game is the vocal minority.
Doomsday.exe please leave this game along with your cringey channel and your 9 year old audience no one likes you LEAVE
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