This guide is intended to help you pick the right mouse, then configure it properly for TF2.
**Picking the Right Mouse**
*Go Optical!*
Simply put, optical sensors are superior to lasers for FPS gaming. The only advantage lasers have is that they track on a wider variety of surfaces. Otherwise they all suffer from many of the "Sensor Quality" considerations covered below.
**Factors to consider:**
-*DPI*:
High enough to reach the useful DPI threshold for your inches/360 and keep your in-game sensitivity low enough to avoid "pixel skipping". For a 1920p resolution this would be whatever DPI allows your cursor to move fast enough with an in-game sensitivity below ~2.7128. Lower resolutions will not need as a high a DPI, while higher resolutions will require more.
-*Polling Rate*:
You want your mouse to be capable of 1000hz (and use that). Most modern mice meet this criteria, but be sure to find out that the mouse can actually perform without problems at its max polling rate. Many mice claim to have 1000hz capabilities but cannot truly hold that rate stabley and fluctuate below it. Read reviews with actual testing! http://www.overclock.net/ is a great resource for these.
-*Click Response Time*:
How fast your mouse registers the actual click of the m1/m2 buttons. Here are some ratings for a number of mice: http://www.overclock.net/t/1411332/mouse-button-lag-comparison
-*Sensor Quality*:
Below are the main considerations for the quality of a sensor to keep in mind when going through reviews of mice
* Acceleration
* Prediction
* Lift off distance
* Max perfect tracking speed
* Malfunction/ Skipping speed
* Lag/Delay
* Jitter
* Smoothing
* Pixel walk
* Pixel skipping
For info on what these are and succinct reviews of various mice's performance in the above regards, read this excellent post:
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=56240.0
-*Mouse feet*:
You want these to PFTE (100% Teflon), some mice skimp on mouse feet material and use subtances with a lower friction coefficient.
-*Mouse Weight Matters*
It's easy to discount the weight of the mouse when making your choice. Using a slick pad? Heavier mice generate more momentum and can prove unwieldy. Ultimately this comes down to personal preference, but lighter mice tend to provide superior "finesse".
**Picking the Right DPI**
Higher DPI is only useful to a certain (specific) point--the point of having a sufficiently high DPI is to prevent "pixel skipping", which is the phenomenon of your FOV (your crosshair/cursor/view) moving at more than 1 pixel at a time no matter how small the mouse movement. This occurs when the in-game sensitivity multiplier is too high. As mentioned, with no acceleration and a 1920x1080 resolution, the maximum in-game sensitivity without pixel-skipping is 2.7128, as derived by the formula found here: http://www.funender.com/quake/mouse/index.html
The higher your resolution, the higher a DPI you will need. Use the above link to find your max useful DPI if you use a different resolution than 1920p.
*Do NOT use a DPI any higher than you need!* Higher DPI's generally mean lower max tracking and malfunction/skipping speeds (how fast you can move your mouse before it experiences tracking errors), as well as the emergence of "Jitter" (cursor shakes rapidly, as if vibrating).
The other important thing to know about DPI is that every mouse has "Native DPI Steps". These are the DPI settings the mouse is actually capable of--some mice give other DPI options which take a native step then interpolate it to "fudge" a different "DPI", and this interpolation creates minor inaccuracies in tracking. "Next Gen" mice using the brand new Avago 3310 sensor, which should become the new standard among most non-Razer or Logitech mice, for the most part only have native steps as options, happily.
**tl;dr:**
To find the right DPI for your inches/360 and mouse, find out what your mouse's available Native DPI Steps are, then use the lowest one that can keep your in-game sensitivity low enough to avoid pixel skipping.
Here is a long list of mice and their sensors to help you in your research:
http://www.overclock.net/t/854100/gaming-mouse-sensor-list
**Proper Mouse Settings in TF2**
- *Use Raw Input*
Just do it. Google what it is if you'd like, but all you need to know is that it is definitively better. There are rumors that there may be a hint of input lag added, but this is insignificant compared to the problems of negative acceleration, framerate dependent cursor movement, and susceptibility to problems built into Windows with hard-to-get-rid-of acceleration and such.
-*Disable "mouse filtering"*
It is simply bad. Untick that box in your Mouse Options in the TF2 menu, or put this in your autoexec.cfg: "m_filter 0"
-*Disable Acceleration*
For "precision weapons" which require pixel-by-pixel accuracy (sniper rifle, ambassador, etc.), it is widely recommended that you disable acceleration, or at least try out doing so. If you have Raw Input enabled (DO IT), simply disable accel in the Mouse section of the TF2 Menu or put the following in your autoexec.cfg:
m_customaccel_exponent 0
m_customaccel_max 0
m_customaccel_scale 0
m_filter 0
m_forward 1
m_mouseaccel1 0
m_mouseaccel2 0
m_mousespeed 1
m_customaccel 0
**Picking Out a Mouse Surface**
The most overlooked factor in choosing a mouse pad is *durability*--most pads wear out in the area you swipe your mouse most, and end up having inconsistent glide (friction) in different parts of the pad.
You also want a pad which will not eat up your mouse feet.
Other than that, I'll defer to the "Choosing a Mousepad" section of this essential mouse guide (read the whole thing, it's great):
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/tech-support/333648-an-overview-of-mouse-technology
I personally have tried an obscene number of pads of every sort, and consider the FUNC surfaces head and shoulders above the rest. These are lightly textured black hard pads (the type of surface sensors track best on), they are gentle on mouse feet, and they simply do not wear.
**Maximize Your FPS!**
Higher FPS = lower input lag. Simply put, the higher the better, and the more responsive your mouse will feel (among many other benefits which I will not cover at the moment--read up!).
Razer GameBooster can really help here, as can a performance config--here's mine:
http://pastebin.com/GWqDFVtE
I hope you found this guide helpful. Feel free to ask questions, request anything I missed, or debate any assertions made.
Love,
stabby stabby
GINYU FORCE RULES
**Useful Links:**
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=56240.0
Mouse Guide with links to good resources and relevant software
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/tech-support/333648-an-overview-of-mouse-technology
The ultimate guide to mice. Great detailed read.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1433882/gaming-and-mouse-response-bios-optimization-guide-for-modern-pc-hardware-2014-r0ach-edition
Mouse Responsiveness guide
This guide is intended to help you pick the right mouse, then configure it properly for TF2.
[b]**Picking the Right Mouse**[/b]
[i]*Go Optical!*[/i]
Simply put, optical sensors are superior to lasers for FPS gaming. The only advantage lasers have is that they track on a wider variety of surfaces. Otherwise they all suffer from many of the "Sensor Quality" considerations covered below.
[b]**Factors to consider:**[/b]
-[i]*DPI*[/i]:
High enough to reach the useful DPI threshold for your inches/360 and keep your in-game sensitivity low enough to avoid "pixel skipping". For a 1920p resolution this would be whatever DPI allows your cursor to move fast enough with an in-game sensitivity below ~2.7128. Lower resolutions will not need as a high a DPI, while higher resolutions will require more.
-[i]*Polling Rate*[/i]:
You want your mouse to be capable of 1000hz (and use that). Most modern mice meet this criteria, but be sure to find out that the mouse can actually perform without problems at its max polling rate. Many mice claim to have 1000hz capabilities but cannot truly hold that rate stabley and fluctuate below it. Read reviews with actual testing! http://www.overclock.net/ is a great resource for these.
-[i]*Click Response Time*[/i]:
How fast your mouse registers the actual click of the m1/m2 buttons. Here are some ratings for a number of mice: http://www.overclock.net/t/1411332/mouse-button-lag-comparison
-[i]*Sensor Quality*[/i]:
Below are the main considerations for the quality of a sensor to keep in mind when going through reviews of mice
[list]
* Acceleration
* Prediction
* Lift off distance
* Max perfect tracking speed
* Malfunction/ Skipping speed
* Lag/Delay
* Jitter
* Smoothing
* Pixel walk
* Pixel skipping
[/list]
For info on what these are and succinct reviews of various mice's performance in the above regards, read this excellent post:
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=56240.0
-[i]*Mouse feet*[/i]:
You want these to PFTE (100% Teflon), some mice skimp on mouse feet material and use subtances with a lower friction coefficient.
-[i]*Mouse Weight Matters*[/i]
It's easy to discount the weight of the mouse when making your choice. Using a slick pad? Heavier mice generate more momentum and can prove unwieldy. Ultimately this comes down to personal preference, but lighter mice tend to provide superior "finesse".
[b]**Picking the Right DPI**[/b]
Higher DPI is only useful to a certain (specific) point--the point of having a sufficiently high DPI is to prevent "pixel skipping", which is the phenomenon of your FOV (your crosshair/cursor/view) moving at more than 1 pixel at a time no matter how small the mouse movement. This occurs when the in-game sensitivity multiplier is too high. As mentioned, with no acceleration and a 1920x1080 resolution, the maximum in-game sensitivity without pixel-skipping is 2.7128, as derived by the formula found here: http://www.funender.com/quake/mouse/index.html
The higher your resolution, the higher a DPI you will need. Use the above link to find your max useful DPI if you use a different resolution than 1920p.
[i][u]*Do NOT use a DPI any higher than you need!*[/u][/i] Higher DPI's generally mean lower max tracking and malfunction/skipping speeds (how fast you can move your mouse before it experiences tracking errors), as well as the emergence of "Jitter" (cursor shakes rapidly, as if vibrating).
The other important thing to know about DPI is that every mouse has "Native DPI Steps". These are the DPI settings the mouse is actually capable of--some mice give other DPI options which take a native step then interpolate it to "fudge" a different "DPI", and this interpolation creates minor inaccuracies in tracking. "Next Gen" mice using the brand new Avago 3310 sensor, which should become the new standard among most non-Razer or Logitech mice, for the most part only have native steps as options, happily.
[b]**tl;dr:**[/b]
To find the right DPI for your inches/360 and mouse, find out what your mouse's available Native DPI Steps are, then use the lowest one that can keep your in-game sensitivity low enough to avoid pixel skipping.
Here is a long list of mice and their sensors to help you in your research:
http://www.overclock.net/t/854100/gaming-mouse-sensor-list
[b]**Proper Mouse Settings in TF2**[/b]
- [i]*Use Raw Input*[/i]
Just do it. Google what it is if you'd like, but all you need to know is that it is definitively better. There are rumors that there may be a hint of input lag added, but this is insignificant compared to the problems of negative acceleration, framerate dependent cursor movement, and susceptibility to problems built into Windows with hard-to-get-rid-of acceleration and such.
-[i]*Disable "mouse filtering"*[/i]
It is simply bad. Untick that box in your Mouse Options in the TF2 menu, or put this in your autoexec.cfg: "[i]m_filter 0[/i]"
-[i]*Disable Acceleration*[/i]
For "precision weapons" which require pixel-by-pixel accuracy (sniper rifle, ambassador, etc.), it is widely recommended that you disable acceleration, or at least try out doing so. If you have Raw Input enabled (DO IT), simply disable accel in the Mouse section of the TF2 Menu or put the following in your autoexec.cfg:
[code] m_customaccel_exponent 0
m_customaccel_max 0
m_customaccel_scale 0
m_filter 0
m_forward 1
m_mouseaccel1 0
m_mouseaccel2 0
m_mousespeed 1
m_customaccel 0[/code]
[b]**Picking Out a Mouse Surface**[/b]
The most overlooked factor in choosing a mouse pad is *durability*--most pads wear out in the area you swipe your mouse most, and end up having inconsistent glide (friction) in different parts of the pad.
You also want a pad which will not eat up your mouse feet.
Other than that, I'll defer to the "Choosing a Mousepad" section of this essential mouse guide (read the whole thing, it's great):
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/tech-support/333648-an-overview-of-mouse-technology
I personally have tried an obscene number of pads of every sort, and consider the FUNC surfaces head and shoulders above the rest. These are lightly textured black hard pads (the type of surface sensors track best on), they are gentle on mouse feet, and they simply do not wear.[s][/s]
[b]**Maximize Your FPS!**[/b]
Higher FPS = lower input lag. Simply put, the higher the better, and the more responsive your mouse will feel (among many other benefits which I will not cover at the moment--read up!).
Razer GameBooster can really help here, as can a performance config--here's mine:
http://pastebin.com/GWqDFVtE
I hope you found this guide helpful. Feel free to ask questions, request anything I missed, or debate any assertions made.
Love,
stabby stabby
GINYU FORCE RULES
**Useful Links:**
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=56240.0
Mouse Guide with links to good resources and relevant software
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/tech-support/333648-an-overview-of-mouse-technology
The ultimate guide to mice. Great detailed read.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1433882/gaming-and-mouse-response-bios-optimization-guide-for-modern-pc-hardware-2014-r0ach-edition
Mouse Responsiveness guide
Nice guide, you may want to include a section on mouse shape though. I value the way a mouse feels and fits in my hands a lot more than it's dpi and polling rate.
Nice guide, you may want to include a section on mouse shape though. I value the way a mouse feels and fits in my hands a lot more than it's dpi and polling rate.
Hm, not sure what I'd put there? Maybe just note claw vs palm vs hybrid grip types?
Hm, not sure what I'd put there? Maybe just note claw vs palm vs hybrid grip types?
Yeah something like that, or maybe just tell people to ask themselves how much they value the size, shape and feel of a mouse compared to the other factors listed in the guide. I may value shape more than most because I palm my mouse and I want one that can fill my hand.
Yeah something like that, or maybe just tell people to ask themselves how much they value the size, shape and feel of a mouse compared to the other factors listed in the guide. I may value shape more than most because I palm my mouse and I want one that can fill my hand.
Yeah, comfort definitely is an essential consideration when choosing a mouse. Dunno, seems kind of self-evident though.
Yeah, comfort definitely is an essential consideration when choosing a mouse. Dunno, seems kind of self-evident though.
oh so having 15 ingame and 1800 dpi with 500 pooling rate is a bad thing...
oh so having 15 ingame and 1800 dpi with 500 pooling rate is a bad thing...
Pixel skipping isn't what matters, it's about the game you play. In TF2 you really do not need pixel perfect precision unless you spend *all* of your time ambassador sniping. There's just nothing that needs it. By your logic a higher FOV requires lower DPI because the pixels in the center of the screen are smaller, but no, the required precision is the same. "Don't use more DPI than is necessary to avoid pixel skipping" is terrible advice, because if you do play with a low resolution, you actually might still need the extra precision, especially if you have a high sensitivity. Your aim isn't measured in pixels, it's measured in angles. yes, you need fine-enough angle control, but above 800 dpi it stops mattering for 90% of games unless you play with a wicked high sens.
Raw input actually increases input lag on some(a minority) systems. It's not that important if you have windows acceleration disabled and the cursor sensitivity is on 1:1.
Filtering can actually help people if they're stuck with a 125hz mouse but push a higher framerate than that. It reduces display stutter. If you play on a really low framerate though the filtering can cause noticeable lag. However, using a 125hz mouse with a framerate above 125 is the only way to make the ingame mouse acceleration consistent, so YMMV if you're taking advantage of that.
Pixel skipping isn't what matters, it's about the game you play. In TF2 you really do not need pixel perfect precision unless you spend *all* of your time ambassador sniping. There's just nothing that needs it. By your logic a higher FOV requires lower DPI because the pixels in the center of the screen are smaller, but no, the required precision is the same. "Don't use more DPI than is necessary to avoid pixel skipping" is terrible advice, because if you do play with a low resolution, you actually might still need the extra precision, especially if you have a high sensitivity. [i]Your aim isn't measured in pixels, it's measured in angles. yes, you need fine-enough angle control, but above 800 dpi it stops mattering for 90% of games unless you play with a wicked high sens.[/i]
Raw input actually increases input lag on some(a minority) systems. It's not that important if you have windows acceleration disabled and the cursor sensitivity is on 1:1.
Filtering can actually help people if they're stuck with a 125hz mouse but push a higher framerate than that. It reduces display stutter. If you play on a really low framerate though the filtering can cause noticeable lag. However, using a 125hz mouse with a framerate above 125 is the only way to make the ingame mouse acceleration consistent, so YMMV if you're taking advantage of that.
wareyaPixel skipping isn't what matters, it's about the game you play. In TF2 you really do not need pixel perfect precision unless you spend *all* of your time ambassador sniping. There's just nothing that needs it. By your logic a higher FOV requires lower DPI because the pixels in the center of the screen are smaller, but no, the required precision is the same. "Don't use more DPI than is necessary to avoid pixel skipping" is terrible advice, because if you do play with a low resolution, you actually might need the extra precision, especially if you have a high sensitivity.
Raw input actually increases input lag on some(a minority) systems. It's not that important if you have windows acceleration disabled and the cursor sensitivity is on 1:1.
Filtering can actually help people if they're stuck with a 125hz mouse but push a higher framerate than that. However, using a 125hz mouse with a framerate above 125 is the only way to make the ingame mouse acceleration consistent, so YMMV if you're taking advantage of that.
I can't say I think you're correct in any of these paragraphs, other than filtering being useful for people using 125hz but pushing 125 FPS (i.e. not using a gaming mouse but running on a gaming computer)...I'ma eat some breakfast and reply later.
In the meantime please read the linked articles, you're being counterfactual.
[quote=wareya]Pixel skipping isn't what matters, it's about the game you play. In TF2 you really do not need pixel perfect precision unless you spend *all* of your time ambassador sniping. There's just nothing that needs it. By your logic a higher FOV requires lower DPI because the pixels in the center of the screen are smaller, but no, the required precision is the same. "Don't use more DPI than is necessary to avoid pixel skipping" is terrible advice, because if you do play with a low resolution, you actually might need the extra precision, especially if you have a high sensitivity.
Raw input actually increases input lag on some(a minority) systems. It's not that important if you have windows acceleration disabled and the cursor sensitivity is on 1:1.
Filtering can actually help people if they're stuck with a 125hz mouse but push a higher framerate than that. However, using a 125hz mouse with a framerate above 125 is the only way to make the ingame mouse acceleration consistent, so YMMV if you're taking advantage of that.[/quote]
I can't say I think you're correct in any of these paragraphs, other than filtering being useful for people using 125hz but pushing 125 FPS (i.e. not using a gaming mouse but running on a gaming computer)...I'ma eat some breakfast and reply later.
In the meantime please read the linked articles, you're being counterfactual.
stabbyyou're being counterfactual.
No... Everything I said is plain math. If you can't see where it fits yourself and rely on other highly specific things to give you a complete picture of everything, when they're just highly specific like what I said, I don't know what to tell you. "Pixel skipping is a thing" doesn't mean "pixel skipping is all that matters".
[quote=stabby]you're being counterfactual.[/quote]
No... Everything I said is plain math. If you can't see where it fits yourself and rely on other highly specific things to give you a complete picture of everything, when they're just highly specific like what I said, I don't know what to tell you. "Pixel skipping is a thing" doesn't mean "pixel skipping is all that matters".
I saw no math (and no sources).
I didn't say pixel skipping is all that matters.
I'm hungry. Will reply in full later, and amend the OP if it's called for.
I saw no math (and no sources).
I didn't say pixel skipping is all that matters.
I'm hungry. Will reply in full later, and amend the OP if it's called for.
Don't forget to include the fact that higher DPI is needed for sniper.
20 FOV is the number you'll want in the formula, I believe.
Don't forget to include the fact that higher DPI is needed for sniper.
20 FOV is the number you'll want in the formula, I believe.
SnowdreamDon't forget to include the fact that higher DPI is needed for sniper.
20 FOV is the number you'll want in the formula, I believe.
Ah shit. I forgot to mention FOV factoring into it. Thanks. Breakfast for real then I'll edit xD
[quote=Snowdream]Don't forget to include the fact that higher DPI is needed for sniper.
20 FOV is the number you'll want in the formula, I believe.[/quote]
Ah shit. I forgot to mention FOV factoring into it. Thanks. Breakfast for real then I'll edit xD
stabbyI saw no math.
If you think you need to write out equations to look at the mathematical relationships that are already there there's something wrong with you.
yaw * sensitivity = minimum angle.
inches per 360 = minimum angle * DPI.
desired inches per 360: subjective.
desired precision: based on ingame geometry.
pixels on screen: representation of ingame geometry. not the actual geometry.
pixels according to ingame geometry: changes according to fov, game engine, and where things are on screen.
Pixel skipping really doesn't matter. You just need a high enough DPI to actually aim accurately over the actual geometry that's there. If it's tiny geometry, you need a low inches/360 or a high DPI. Easy.
stabbyI didn't say pixel skipping is all that matters.
You told people to give avoiding pixel skipping a higher priority than using a comfortable sensitivity, so I think yes, you essenitially did.
[quote=stabby]I saw no math.[/quote]
If you think you need to write out equations to look at the mathematical relationships that are already there there's something wrong with you.
yaw * sensitivity = minimum angle.
inches per 360 = minimum angle * DPI.
desired inches per 360: subjective.
desired precision: [i]based on ingame geometry.[/i]
pixels on screen: representation of ingame geometry. [i]not the actual geometry.[/i]
pixels according to ingame geometry: [i]changes according to fov, game engine, and where things are on screen.[/i]
Pixel skipping really doesn't matter. You just need a high enough DPI to actually aim accurately over the actual geometry that's there. If it's tiny geometry, you need a low inches/360 or a high DPI. Easy.
[quote=stabby]I didn't say pixel skipping is all that matters.[/quote]
You told people to give avoiding pixel skipping a higher priority than using a comfortable sensitivity, so I think yes, you essenitially did.
SnowdreamDon't forget to include the fact that higher DPI is needed for sniper.
20 FOV is the number you'll want in the formula, I believe.
why is dpi related to fov?
[quote=Snowdream]Don't forget to include the fact that higher DPI is needed for sniper.
20 FOV is the number you'll want in the formula, I believe.[/quote]
why is dpi related to fov?
They're trying to relate DPI to pixels on the screen, which are affected by FoV.
They're trying to relate DPI to pixels on the screen, which are affected by FoV.
*To find the right DPI for your inches/360 and mouse, find out what your mouse's available Native DPI Steps are, then use the lowest one that can keep your in-game sensitivity low enough to avoid pixel skipping.*
Try to keep your sens around 2-3-4.
*To find the right DPI for your inches/360 and mouse, find out what your mouse's available Native DPI Steps are, then use the lowest one that can keep your in-game sensitivity low enough to avoid pixel skipping.*
Try to keep your sens around 2-3-4.
is this really a thing? like my sens is 0.75 and i've never noticed any issue with it.
is this really a thing? like my sens is 0.75 and i've never noticed any issue with it.
No. Low sensitivities are fine.
No. Low sensitivities are fine.
I refreshed and this happened
http://puu.sh/cc9rB/915ffc32fd.png
someone's mad
I refreshed and this happened
[img]http://puu.sh/cc9rB/915ffc32fd.png[/img]
someone's mad
it's me i got really mad at you for answering my question
it's me i got really mad at you for answering my question
smobois this really a thing? like my sens is 0.75 and i've never noticed any issue with it.
It's no prob if you're experiencing no jitter or tracking errors when you move your mouse quickly.
[quote=smobo]is this really a thing? like my sens is 0.75 and i've never noticed any issue with it.[/quote]
It's no prob if you're experiencing no jitter or tracking errors when you move your mouse quickly.
wareyaI refreshed and this happened
http://puu.sh/cc9rB/915ffc32fd.png
someone's mad
People do that shit all the time, I've noticed it in almost every thread that immediately after I post the 4 or 5 posts above all got minus fragged some of which made no fucking sense as to why they got minus fragged.
[quote=wareya]I refreshed and this happened
[img]http://puu.sh/cc9rB/915ffc32fd.png[/img]
someone's mad[/quote]
People do that shit all the time, I've noticed it in almost every thread that immediately after I post the 4 or 5 posts above all got minus fragged some of which made no fucking sense as to why they got minus fragged.
Ok. So is 5600 dpi (I know it's unnecessary but I bought the mouse, why not use its highest value) coupled with a sensitivity of .37. Good? Bad? Messes me up somehow? 1000hz polling rate, 144 hz monitor at 1600x900 and always pushing over 100+ frames, firefights, etc.
Ok. So is 5600 dpi (I know it's unnecessary but I bought the mouse, why not use its highest value) coupled with a sensitivity of .37. Good? Bad? Messes me up somehow? 1000hz polling rate, 144 hz monitor at 1600x900 and always pushing over 100+ frames, firefights, etc.
wareyaRaw input actually increases input lag on some(a minority) systems. It's not that important if you have windows acceleration disabled and the cursor sensitivity is on 1:1.
This is untrue and was actually debunked by tests in one of the links. Please read the post and the sources if you're going to bother engaging in this discussion.
wareya
Pixel skipping really doesn't matter. You just need a high enough DPI to actually aim accurately over the actual geometry that's there. If it's tiny geometry, you need a low inches/360 or a high DPI. Easy.
Sure it matters. You can't move your view 1 pixel at a time when you have pixel skipping. This not only means precision aiming is made more difficult, but your view will move in an increasingly choppy fashion as the skipping increases.
wareyaYou told people to give avoiding pixel skipping a higher priority than using a comfortable sensitivity, so I think yes, you essenitially did.
I did not say that. Quote what you're talking about?
I told people that pixel skipping occurs when using too high of an in-game sensitivity. I'm not sure what you mean by "comfortable" sensitivity--I'm not talking about inches/360. How could pixel skipping be more comfortable for someone?
[quote=wareya]
Raw input actually increases input lag on some(a minority) systems. It's not that important if you have windows acceleration disabled and the cursor sensitivity is on 1:1.[/quote] This is untrue and was actually debunked by tests in one of the links. Please read the post and the sources if you're going to bother engaging in this discussion.
[quote=wareya]
Pixel skipping really doesn't matter. You just need a high enough DPI to actually aim accurately over the actual geometry that's there. If it's tiny geometry, you need a low inches/360 or a high DPI. Easy.[/quote]
Sure it matters. You can't move your view 1 pixel at a time when you have pixel skipping. This not only means precision aiming is made more difficult, but your view will move in an increasingly choppy fashion as the skipping increases.
[quote=wareya]
You told people to give avoiding pixel skipping a higher priority than using a comfortable sensitivity, so I think yes, you essenitially did.[/quote] I did not say that. Quote what you're talking about?
I told people that pixel skipping occurs when using too high of an in-game sensitivity. I'm not sure what you mean by "comfortable" sensitivity--I'm not talking about inches/360. How could pixel skipping be more comfortable for someone?
DaStabajOk. So is 5600 dpi (I know it's unnecessary but I bought the mouse, why not use its highest value) coupled with a sensitivity of .37. Good? Bad? Messes me up somehow? 1000hz polling rate, 144 hz monitor at 1600x900 and always pushing over 100+ frames, firefights, etc.
If you never notice any problems with it then it should be fine. This guide seems to mostly be for people looking for new mice.
[quote=DaStabaj]Ok. So is 5600 dpi (I know it's unnecessary but I bought the mouse, why not use its highest value) coupled with a sensitivity of .37. Good? Bad? Messes me up somehow? 1000hz polling rate, 144 hz monitor at 1600x900 and always pushing over 100+ frames, firefights, etc.[/quote]
If you never notice any problems with it then it should be fine. This guide seems to mostly be for people looking for new mice.
DaStabajOk. So is 5600 dpi (I know it's unnecessary but I bought the mouse, why not use its highest value) coupled with a sensitivity of .37. Good? Bad? Messes me up somehow? 1000hz polling rate, 144 hz monitor at 1600x900 and always pushing over 100+ frames, firefights, etc.
Your maximum tracking speed is likely suffering from you putting your DPI that high, but that's probably not big of an issues at even an 8in/360.
[quote=DaStabaj]Ok. So is 5600 dpi (I know it's unnecessary but I bought the mouse, why not use its highest value) coupled with a sensitivity of .37. Good? Bad? Messes me up somehow? 1000hz polling rate, 144 hz monitor at 1600x900 and always pushing over 100+ frames, firefights, etc.[/quote]
Your maximum tracking speed is likely suffering from you putting your DPI that high, but that's probably not big of an issues at even an 8in/360.
ComangliaDaStabajOk. So is 5600 dpi (I know it's unnecessary but I bought the mouse, why not use its highest value) coupled with a sensitivity of .37. Good? Bad? Messes me up somehow? 1000hz polling rate, 144 hz monitor at 1600x900 and always pushing over 100+ frames, firefights, etc.
Your maximum tracking speed is likely suffering from you putting your DPI that high, but that's probably not big of an issues at even an 8in/360.
Jitter's a more likely issue. You can do tests for that using MS Paint. See the geekhack thread.
Why not just use a lower DPI and higher sensitivity to be safe?
[quote=Comanglia][quote=DaStabaj]Ok. So is 5600 dpi (I know it's unnecessary but I bought the mouse, why not use its highest value) coupled with a sensitivity of .37. Good? Bad? Messes me up somehow? 1000hz polling rate, 144 hz monitor at 1600x900 and always pushing over 100+ frames, firefights, etc.[/quote]
Your maximum tracking speed is likely suffering from you putting your DPI that high, but that's probably not big of an issues at even an 8in/360.[/quote]
Jitter's a more likely issue. You can do tests for that using MS Paint. See the geekhack thread.
Why not just use a lower DPI and higher sensitivity to be safe?
honestly boys I would just ignore minimum DPI/minimum angle/pixel skipping completely.
stabby is certainly making it into a much larger issue than it is.
if you use 400dpi with a high enough sens to make this an issue, you're not going to be able to physically control the mouse to the degree of accuracy where it matters. and it won't be a noticeable difference in smoothness either.
its just so irrelevant for 99.9% of gamers (possibly with the exception of surgeon aimers trying to play CS, but they're doing it wrong in the first place). how the sensor performs/feels at that DPI is way more important than 'avoiding pixel skipping'
source: 8 sens 400 dpi
its like coming in here and being like everyone has to use at least 3840x2160 resolution because you have 4 times more pixels on the screen for maximum precision!
honestly boys I would just ignore minimum DPI/minimum angle/pixel skipping completely.
stabby is certainly making it into a much larger issue than it is.
if you use 400dpi with a high enough sens to make this an issue, you're not going to be able to physically control the mouse to the degree of accuracy where it matters. and it won't be a noticeable difference in smoothness either.
its just so irrelevant for 99.9% of gamers (possibly with the exception of surgeon aimers trying to play CS, but they're doing it wrong in the first place). how the sensor performs/feels at that DPI is way more important than 'avoiding pixel skipping'
source: 8 sens 400 dpi
its like coming in here and being like everyone has to use at least 3840x2160 resolution because you have 4 times more pixels on the screen for maximum precision!
wonderlandhow the sensor performs/feels at that DPI is way more important than 'avoiding pixel skipping'
Well, yeah, I don't think I implied otherwise.
Pixel skipping exists, so why not avoid it if there are no benefits to alternative configurations? I also make the point that sensors tend to perform better at lower DPI's, mind you.
I'm simply informing people here, no reason to get hostile. I appreciate feedback, but maybe keep it, you know, relevant to something.
[quote=wonderland]how the sensor performs/feels at that DPI is way more important than 'avoiding pixel skipping'
[/quote]
Well, yeah, I don't think I implied otherwise.
Pixel skipping exists, so why not avoid it if there are no benefits to alternative configurations? I also make the point that sensors tend to perform better at lower DPI's, mind you.
I'm simply informing people here, no reason to get hostile. I appreciate feedback, but maybe keep it, you know, relevant to something.
stabbySure it matters. You can't move your view 1 pixel at a time when you have pixel skipping. This not only means precision aiming is made more difficult, but your view will move in an increasingly choppy fashion as the skipping increases.
As I said, the pixels are just a representation of the ingame geometry. You don't aim at pixels. You aim at geometry. People got away with 640 wide resolutions in counter-strike for YEARS, despite the game requiring such ridiculous precision, because they aimed at the geometry that the pixels implied, not the actual pixels. Please give a real actual legitimate reason why you think that for 3d games that individual pixels are so important and not the geometry.
stabbyI did not say that. Quote what you're talking about?
I told people that pixel skipping occurs when using too high of an in-game sensitivity. I'm not sure what you mean by "comfortable" sensitivity--I'm not talking about inches/360. How could pixel skipping be more comfortable for someone?
I'm referring to this:
The higher your resolution, the higher a DPI you will need. Use the above link to find your max useful DPI if you use a different resolution than [1920 wide].
*Do NOT use a DPI any higher than you need!*
It's very wrong, it implies that if you have a very high resolution monitor, you need a higher DPI mouse, or to lower your sensitivity. It's totally wrong, the pixels on your screen don't matter in TF2 aside from how well they do or don't show the ingame geometry.
wonderland is totally right.
[quote=stabby]Sure it matters. You can't move your view 1 pixel at a time when you have pixel skipping. This not only means precision aiming is made more difficult, but your view will move in an increasingly choppy fashion as the skipping increases.[/quote]
As I said, the pixels are just a representation of the ingame geometry. You don't aim at pixels. You aim at geometry. People got away with 640 wide resolutions in counter-strike for YEARS, despite the game requiring such ridiculous precision, because they aimed at the geometry that the pixels implied, not the actual pixels. Please give a real actual legitimate reason why you think that for 3d games that individual pixels are so important and not the geometry.
[quote=stabby]I did not say that. Quote what you're talking about?
I told people that pixel skipping occurs when using too high of an in-game sensitivity. I'm not sure what you mean by "comfortable" sensitivity--I'm not talking about inches/360. How could pixel skipping be more comfortable for someone?[/quote]
I'm referring to this:
[quote]The higher your resolution, the higher a DPI you will need. Use the above link to find your max useful DPI if you use a different resolution than [1920 wide].
[i][u]*Do NOT use a DPI any higher than you need!*[/u][/i]
[/quote]
It's very wrong, it implies that if you have a very high resolution monitor, you need a higher DPI mouse, or to lower your sensitivity. It's totally wrong, the pixels on your screen don't matter in TF2 aside from how well they do or don't show the ingame geometry.
wonderland is totally right.