ron whyd u do it :(

just like every time you make steel allstar!

Gottem? Granted I've only made it once, but ok.

It would be nice if we could remain civil here. I hate digging through pages of random shit looking for actual reports :/

podgy, stop responding

No you.

Ok, Smobo, that was my last one

oh i figured with 4 seasons there and how big your ego is it must have been more

3.
First one we sucked
Second one I went to China (for study abroad) Week 8 and the team lost the week 8 + first round of playoffs
Third was last season

yo podgy stop posting you're digging yourself a deeper hole. if you value your reputation going forward you need to think about what you're doing and 1) apologize and 2) keep to yourself for a while and calm down. seriously.

http://i.imgur.com/woWT6jI.jpg

Ayy lmao

[*]

all 3 u sucked

I am genuinely curious why you hacked Rondego, like you can keep pretending you didn't, but I feel that the only way anyone will forgive you or trust you is if you explain yourself, it's not like admitting it will hurt you at any point when everyone knows you hack and you already got banned, I appreciate what you do for our community (camera work for EVL) and I think that the best way to regain our trust (if you want to at all) is honesty.

ron was actually one of the nicest people in ugc and this makes me really sad

I'd honestly love to say that I cheated just so I could get this whole thing over with because it's hell, but I can't, because I didn't. I have some ideas, and I'll be working hard over the next few weeks researching TF2's netcode and the demo recording system to prove definitively that my aim couldn't have been assisted, since demos and explanations haven't been working. In the mean time though, hope you guys are all enjoying the entertainment.

I vote in favor of Rondego, he's been thorough in his videos and I don't see enough evidence in how he's hacking. I can see the confusion and similarities that might've made some reviewers think otherwise but, I've seen his PoV's and I actually believe that major proving 'factors' of him hacking has been overlooked. Horribly.
Best of luck appealing.

Putting yourself in the victim position saying "I don't cheat and I don't know how to prove it" is the worst thing to do and people will make no efforts trying to help you anymore. As a former head AC in etf2l I can say trying to cooperate with UGC AC is a pain in the ass. We've sent them demos of convicted players with obvious telltale signs of cheating and they did not feel that these players had to be banned. AC work is a fuckload of work that you are committing to in your free time and you don't even get paid for it, so I can tell why people don't put as much effort in it. As far as I know they don't even have an AC and league admins get to judge players. None of them knows jackshit about cheats.

How far back was that though? This year they've been working with TF2 Center and others to tackle cheating.

Also how can they be uncooperative, not exist, and not know what they're doing all at once? That doesn't really make sense. I think you're blending various experiences and anecdotes and it doesn't reflect the current situation.

What I'm getting at is never has there been a better time than this for UGC and ETF2L to work together on hackers. I think both sides have had bad experiences and impressions of each other, but if they could try again I think it would do a lot of good. Talk to ETF2L's webmaster emb and you'll find out that only a few months ago the UGC admins reached out and vastly helped improve how ETF2L spots VAC bans. Both sides can learn from each other, and comparing notes on players could crackdown on a lot of hackers.

Many staff members from both sites have changed over the last few years and there is little reason for this bad blood to continue. If the two sites (and perhaps TF2 Center) had good working relationships, the competitive experiences for all players would be improved.

I've spent 11 seasons playing heavy(sandbagging for life), and WAY TOO much time doing heavy v heavy ammomod mge to tighten up those last few %s of tracking, I like to think I'm rather good at by it now, at least in some parts of the heavy class. What keyed me off though wasn't just his tracking, which went from eh, to fucking on point, but was the mid range and longer damage number and their ticks, which looked higher and more frequent than they should of.

Remember Heavy fires in a random spread cone, and even with prefect tracking you'll miss shots because of that spread, its possible he is the luckiest heavy in the world with where they were landing, which was always on target, but I suspect a bit of spread reduction.

As an aside I use 2.5ish per 360 as well, and often I look smooth from POV when tracking, and can do stupid fast flicks, but its the changing off target that looks suspicious as well, with that high of sens there is almost always a "wobble" when you change direction or flick to targets, it just happens from the movement of the wrist when .31 of an inch moves your aim a whole 45 fucking degrees, aka half way across the screen, with such high sense (other heavies here can back me) there is almost always that wobble when pulling and a target that started to move diagonal or that fraction of a moment where you over-aim on a juking target before you drawback. I've practiced and cut mine down to pretty close (within ~5%) as a I think a person can with a heavy aim, obviously bots are going to beat people hands down every time though.

When the suspected moments occurred you never pulled off even a juking moving target or missed a shot, not even for a moment. Or hey maybe you are just that good or lucky, which would be nice because you are a chill guy, but I mean come on...

And this is why a public vigilante thread like this is detrimental to a lot of AC cases.

Too many unfounded opinions without any AC work under their belts trying to figure out if something can be legit.
Without a doubt there are a lot of players that have been caught using aimbot, wall hack or other cheats, but those were the blatant ones.
I haven't looked into Rondego's case, because frankly I haven't had time for it, but from what I'm reading a lot of comments here assume he's cheating and you just have to find the evidence.

Please remember that this isn't a popularity contest and you get to vote if you think someone is cheating. You are positively sure of someone being innocent, you have your suspicions or you have undeniable proof someone is cheating in the form of AC evidence.

Like quintosh says, there are only a handful of players in this community that have the tools, ability or experience to determine someone is cheating. Edge cases like Rondego can get seriously hurt by vigilantism or bad evidence stacked with bad calls (which have happened in the past in ETF2L, see Quad's case I guess).

I've been playing heavy for a really long time so this is pretty interesting and I'm going to take my time to review everything, just wanted to attend people to the fact that this isn't the way to go on trying to determine cheats.

I wish there was a moderated thread where we could just post reports and relevant evidence for later inspection. It's important that it's open, though, so that others can see the reports and add additional evidence or comments about previous incidents that wouldn't otherwise show up (see my posts in the first few pages).

john milter is a man of the people, he can't be silenced.

O_O

kKaltUu is a cheater confirmed. I saw from pixels and I've seen a lot of pixels in my time.

While I agree that the Rondego case has gotten a little out of hand and has gotten kind of messy (mob mentality kicking in?), I would say that this thread overall has been very beneficial to the community in weeding out the very obvious hackers. And the overwhelming majority of people reported in this thread were so blatant in their hacking they didn't really require a discussion Pretty much all the ones I personally reported were beyond obvious and the cheaters with dead giveaway moments I highlighted in the form of a video clip.

This was my original intention, as stated in the first post. I never really wanted the thread to be about accusing people that *might* be cheating, I think generally that should probably be done on a more private setting with UGC/ETF2L admins. Personally If I suspect someone of cheating but don't have concrete evidence, I bookmark their logs.tf or tf2c profile if I suspect they *might* be cheating then review them later as more logs / STV's become available.

-------------------

As for my opinion on Rondego (not that it really matters much, because I'm not the one making the call if he is UGC banned or not). I'm still a bit up in the air about him. I've really only looked at 5-10 minutes worth of youtube demo clips. I can say for certain that he certainly at the very least framed himself to look like a hacker with several of his clips.

At the end of the day though UGC made the call. Whether they had some additional evidence that is not disclosed in this thread, or if they made the call just based on the overwhelming amount of shady stuff surrounding Rondego, we may never know.

Never knew Steel Heavies gained this much attention. I bet if he wasn't doing stuff like EVL TV / YT no one would give two shits and kept this whole dilemma brief i.e. "Meh, just another hacker..." Having status in the community = "OMG LOLOLOL SUCH HACKS YOU SUCK LOLOLOL ENJOY UR BAN SHITTER"

no its because he hacks and people want him banned
ur also an idiot

They had the match STV and his demo POV, I believe. I'm 99% sure they review stuff in-house before making a decision.

It can be but it's generally not too much if you only got a handful of demos to review.
I'm not part of the UGC team, I just (somewhat) enjoy doing my own investigations on players that others are apprehensive about reporting. Once you've worked out a routine it cuts out most of the stress.
I think I got a good system going and I'd like to think I'm fairly accurate as everyone I've slammed down as cheating happens to be folks who would end up banned from the league.

They do, currently it's about 3 or 4 folks

Since the information of exactly who's on the team isn't public this could be the case for some folks.
I have a general idea of who the peeps on the AC team might be and I can say at least 1 or 2 of them are pretty well informed.

However, I do recall having to explain to a league admin at one point on how wallhack textures work which left me with little faith. But I'm pretty certain this dude isn't on the team though, at least currently...