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#3654 PC Build Thread in Hardware
bearodactyl

Yeah net graph can drop your fps more than normal, so its probaby not as bad as i assumed.

You can overclock a 3600 on a b450 tomahawk max comfortably for example. The stock coolers are a bit trash though so you probably wont get much out of it without losing your mind due to how annoying the stock cooler sounds.

You could gamble and get some cheap Samsung B-Die RAM. Generally 3200mhz cl14 indicates this. And you can use Ryzen DRAM calculator as a base to overclock your memory. B-Die is easier to overclock and better in general. I have had luck doing this and maybe your friend did this too. You can use b-die finder to see if the RAM you are looking at has b-die modules.
RAM overclocking is painful to do because you have to be sure you get no memory errors over a long period of time and the OC may not work at the end of it, so its probably easier to get the ram speed and timings you want.

But its important to keep in mind - if your current system does everything you want it to do, is there a reason to upgrade?
you might get close to 240fps with the right settings.

Setsul

Q3 release for zen 3. September is the speculated release date that ive read from various sites and heard from numerous people on videos etc.

Never said that a performance goal was irrelevant. I said i weigh both performance and value equally. If theres a way to get 240fps at a cheaper cost, why not do it? Otherwise we would recommend i9 9700k 5.1ghz bin from silicon lottery and a 750ti.
And multiple people have posted 3600 benchmarks that seem to indicate that it is possible to get over 240fps in TF2, so theres no real need for anything more powerful if 240fps is the goal. That saved cost can be used for a better GPU, RAM, extra case fans or a cooler, even if it is "only" $50.

Might be the difference between a 2060 S and 2070 S, and we can all agree the stock cooler sucks. Using the B-die trick previously mentioned i easily got 7% more perf compared to stock xmp settings in TF2. And since zen 2 chips can do more than 3466, it will probably be more than that. This is a perfectly valid option.

3600XT will be lower quality silicon than a 3800xt. i dont think the majority will overclock to 4.6Ghz even. How else can a 12 core and 16 core cpu in the same lineup use the same power with near identical clock speeds? Because the 3600XT is a lower quality bin than the top chips. I doubt they would waste many good 4.7ghz 6 core chips on a 3600xt when you need 2 of them for a 3900xt. Just a prediction. But I doubt 3600xts will OC to 4.7.

How can you be so certain that they wont increase the prices for zen 3? They tried that with the navi cards last time. What's stopping them from increasing the prices this time if they have a clearly superior product? There have been no leaks about zen 3 specs or prices yet, so not possible to know this, unless there is some info im unaware about.

If we dont care about increasing minimum fps at all, surely that means a 2.4ghz dual core will feel the same as a 5ghz core i9 right? 240fps is the goal and the closer you are to it the better. i said 240fps wont be attainable so not sure where you got those numbers from. pretty sure those numbers wont "fix" the dips either.

posted about 2 years ago
#3650 PC Build Thread in Hardware
Setsul

7% higher clock speeds for 37% more cost for a 3600xt isnt worth it (comparing vs 3600), and I doubt that higher performance will be make or break for 240fps in tf2 anyway. value and performance are equally important imo, especially since you can use that to buy better RAM/GPU. The newer 3600s can overclock higher at lower voltages (compared to launch day silicon) so that 7% gap can be reduced a bit if he is willing to overclock.

waiting for zen 3 is not the equivalent of waiting 2 years, and its been stated numerous times they are on track for Q3 2020. it will probably have 13+% IPC gains and higher clock speeds. Considering a "4600" is likely to be around $250-ish, i think its worth waiting for if "September launch" rumors are to be believed. If he plans to wait for new GPUs, might aswell wait for the new CPUs so the prices will drop on existing parts or if zen 3 is god tier then a 4600 is an option.

based on my past experience with broadwell, which is basically haswell, i dont the 120fps on midfights is normal. something is wrong, whether its unstable, throttling or maybe its a windows/bloat issue. perhaps i remember wrongly, but my fps was not 120 on midfights on any map, even sunshine.

he didnt increase the voltage so theres room for improvement there, as he isnt using a box cooler. he might have a potato tier processor though, who knows. unlikely to get 240fps from an OC but will hopefully fix the dips he was having. stock settings should be stable, about 3.8-3.9ghz in game hopefully. benchmark before and after see if anything changes.

posted about 2 years ago
#3648 PC Build Thread in Hardware
Setsul

yes most of the cpus were released on 7/7 last year. used announced/released interchangeably.

But it is true that nothing zen 3 related will be released this month which was the point i was making, and most likely September time, which is what people should wait for not a zen 2 refresh, considering 3600 silicon has also improved.

buying a 3600xt for 100mhz and a increase for 25% more cost isnt worth it at all. especially considering you can buy a 3600 for an even lower price and get most the performance you would get, since they are all on better silicon now. and since zen 3 will be this year, seems a bit wasteful to spend full price on a new cpu that will be released soon. remember 2700x anniversary edition? full price but new cpus came out 3 months later, same situation here.

we are talking

3600 - 4.2ghz
3600x - 4.4ghz
3600xt - 4.5ghz

absolutely not worth it at all.

bearodactyl

if you increase voltage/clocks keep an eye on your temperatures so you dont degrade anything. i think the max recommend voltage is 1.3? if that's too hot for you just decrease the voltage. i wouldn't be comfortable with anything over 85 personally. i think up to 1.4 is safe, as long as you have adequate cooling, which i dont think you have because we are talking dual tower coolers or 280mm AIO.

there should be some haswell overclocking tutorials somewhere on the internet. im sure linustechtips has a decent one.

posted about 2 years ago
#3645 PC Build Thread in Hardware

7/7 was when AMD announced new cpus last year. most likely all releases will be in september-ish aswell as for GPUs.

120fps seems a bit low. you might wanna check your temperatures to see you arent overheating or anything related to throttling in HWinfo64, or your OC may not be stable. idk if you have cleaned your pc since you got it, but worst case it can be 5 years without cleaning. might be worthwhile to give it a clean if you have bad temps or have never done it. if we are talking 6v6 (been a while since i was on ddr3 but) i felt like i got more than that at a lower clock speed.

if you havent increased core voltage at all or optimized LLC and stuff you probably have more performance on the table/stability. you either got one of the worst 4770k's known to man or you are doing something wrong. chances are you probably forgot to do something.

SMT can negatively effect your performance in tf2 (and can effect potentially security if you are intel xd), and is most useful for rendering in blender or something like that by like 10-30%. probably wont make a huge difference day to day, although Ryzens is superior.

posted about 2 years ago
#3634 PC Build Thread in Hardware

for around 70 pounds you can get a dark rock pro 4, or slightly more expensive Noctua NH-D15 for the upmost in performance+noise. These are pretty much the best air coolers you can buy. Noctua have good customer service also if that is worth anything. But they perform within 1C of each other so probably down to if you like black or beige more.

For less than 60, you can get a Cryorig h7 or a be quiet! dark rock 4, which are also good tower coolers. Ive heard good things about the ThermalRight Macho also, but i cant tell you how it performs off the top of my head.

All of these coolers are AM4 compatible out of the box so no worries there.

I have an NH-D15 and it is very quiet and performs well. It comes with updated AM4 mounting hardware despite what some sites say and low noise adapters to lower maximum RPM speeds. Easy to mount and do maintenance on it too. Just make sure your case can fit it with both fans.

From what I understand, BeQuiet! is a lower frequency but louder, so it isnt noticeable either. I havent tested this personally though so I may be wrong.

posted about 2 years ago
#3623 PC Build Thread in Hardware
Nygma

What do you plan on doing with the pc. When do you plan on building it

I know those dell units have proprietary PSUs which is why you cant upgrade past anything that needs 6pin power, which is then why you are wanting to "upgrade".

Considering the fact you have all new components disregarding the cpu, you might as well buy a new pc all together. You can spend a bit more and get waaay more performance and features, like higher than 2400 ram speed, overclocking/pbo, better I/O like USB 3.1 gen 2 and more cores.

That 3200mhz ram is going to waste on that h270 board, since 2400mhz is the max speed. h270 is a garbage platform in 2020. No upgrade path, same old skylake quadcores. And since you dont plan on an oc its worthless for gaming considering that board is overpriced.

RTX 3000 is coming out soon as well as refreshed zen 2, so it may be worthwhile to wait

posted about 2 years ago
#3613 PC Build Thread in Hardware

I have a 2600x. I can say even with the JEDEC 2133mhz ram (def settings) i get over 200fps in tf2. You might be doing some things wrong. I know the stock cooler is a piece of garbage though and im sure if you buy an aftermarket air cooler you will get 100-200mhz more.

Several things may be able to do:

You can PBO and undervolt and you can get some nice performance gains. Normally i only have 4ghz too, but i can get 150-200mhz extra by doing it. Watch buildzoids video on how to do it, its nice. 2nd gen ryzen PBO is quite dumb so its pretty much necessary : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQ8zdprzEjI

Second: set a static vcore voltage. I set 1.3125v in the bios with load-line calibration.get like 1.29v. This way i "break" precision boost 2 and have better clocks, therefore higher performance. Ive used this and seen no adverse effect on my cpu. You should run Cinebench or something to find out what the CPU naturally sets the voltage to and sort of work around that. Your CPU wont downvolt at idle if you do this.

Third: Manual OC. Most 2600xs, especially if its 2019 era silicon can hit 4.25ghz with 1.35v. I can hit that with 1.325v. But of course you need good cooling to do that. Ive found manual OC takes more time to tune compared to PBO+undervolt. And around 1.33-1.35v is the maximum you can do with good cooling on these chips. I wouldnt do this because your manual OC clock speed will probably be lower than your normal clock speed ingame.

Fourth: Memory Overclocking. You probably have bad memory chips as it is 3200 cl16. But that doesnt mean you cant keep the same effective timings but increase the memory frequency. You would want to do that to increase infinity fabric link speed. Most 2600xs can do memory speeds of 3333 to 3533. Use Ryzen DRAM Calculator and follow some guides on how to properly overclock your memory. This can be risky/annoying to do so i would save this until you are absolutely desperate. Just remember if you do this memory testing for 24/48 hours is imperative.

as for monitors im not in the know but im sure some people will tell you what is the best. Sorry for the wall of text :>

posted about 2 years ago
#3611 PC Build Thread in Hardware

wait for 10th gen intel thats coming out soon if you can, as they have increased clock speeds and lower prices for the CPUs. Should be about a month or so when they come out.

Cooler - try a big dual tower cooler for more overclocking capacity. Noctua NH-D15 is the best but is a bit more expensive. Therefore good alternatives are the be quiet! dark rock pro 4 and the scythe fuma coolers (no need to worry as these coolers are compatible with lga 1200)

You can get a water cooler if you like for slightly better overclocks - the arctic freezer 2 does well according to gamers nexus. But you must realise this extra performance comes with pump noise and potential pump failure, which is hard to know.

posted about 2 years ago
#3607 PC Build Thread in Hardware

the MAX motherboards should be 3rd gen compatible out of the box so nothing to worry. Might be a slightly outdated bios but it will work.

3600 comes with a heatsink and fan in the box. It can be loud so buying an inexpensive air cooler isnt the worst idea. Maybe a cryorig h7 or Scythe Mugen 5. Should fit in that case.

a common SSD is a WD blue. Its inexpensive but it is only sata (imo not that big of a deal). There is an intel 660p 1tb version also. If you want the best, a samsung 960/970 EVO is what you want.

posted about 2 years ago
#3 30 fps in Q/A Help

What are your temperatures like on your CPU/GPU? Use HWINFO64 to check. You might be thermal throttling. If its a prebuilt its unlikely to be overheating though

posted about 2 years ago
#13 TF2 Memory Leak? in Q/A Help

I cant provide you with a cause or solution, but if you say restarting your PC fixes the issue....

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/downloads/rammap

Download RAMMap. After you experience your issue, exit the game and then empty the stand by sets, and potentially the other sets and see if the issue persists - via the empty menu.

This has worked for me on occasion when my game would crash for no reason everytime i launched it, so it may help here.

posted about 2 years ago
#1 TF2 and CS:GO's source code got leaked in TF2 General Discussion

I think evidence is pointing towards Tyler McVicker from VNN...

https://pastebin.com/Sb0guQSN
https://i.4cdn.org/v/1587550048972.png
https://i.imgur.com/Bfoq7RD.png

When you openly ask a valve employee to extract private data from the server, transfer all leaked files to a small group of people and brag about it ... idk.

CSGO, TF2 from 2017 is there as well as a broken F-Stop code base that people have launched, the experimental prelude to Portal 1. If he sent this around to people he is getting in real trouble. I suspect he has more that isn't in the leak, but damn. The damage has been done.

edit: OP was deleted because it linked the source code.

posted about 2 years ago
#3589 PC Build Thread in Hardware
grain_death

Firstly i know its a typo, but we are talking about the 9400f, and if you plan on "enabling multi core enhancement" or anything like that, I wouldnt hold my breath about that on a B series motherboard with a locked processor. It will boost to 3.9ghz max all core, and that is if you are under a 65W TDP, should be fine in games though.

crybaby

You should buy a Ryzen 5 1600 AF. It is basically the 2600 but its cheaper. Look for a 1600 AF or 1600 (12nm)

Having a single stick of memory really isnt worth it imo. You would be better off with 2933mhz/3000 dual channel.

SilentWings fans are good but they are expensive, try for cheaper fans like arctic 120 pwm silent fans. Pretty much do the same thing.

posted about 2 years ago
#3581 PC Build Thread in Hardware
WazrachI'm aware of the infinity fabric decoupling, but mine is running at a 1:1 ratio. I've been using this setup for weeks now in different games, and it's been completely fine.

Decoupling of IF is no bueno, but many 3600s mostly seem to work fine on >1800mhz, you may need to increase the IF voltage to get higher RAM clocks, but you could degrade the CPU by doing that so its kind of risky. Not worth it.

Just curious to what voltages/timings/settings you are running at. In theory 1.5V with B die is safe 24/7 as long as you can cool it.

posted about 2 years ago
#3577 PC Build Thread in Hardware
WazrachSpeaking of RAM, I got the Patriot Memory Viper Steel Series DDR4 16GB (2 x 8GB) 4400MHz kit. You can overclock this to 3600Mhz C14. I tried 3733Mhz C14, but it wasn't stable.

That kit is running at 4400 cl15 with XMP. Not sure how you are only able to get cl14 at 3600, unless you arent giving it enough volts or something, because 4400 at cl15 is harder to run than 3733cl14. Probably an unlucky draw on your IMC.

Anyway B-die is out of many peoples budgets because it can be more expensive and overclocking ram is too much of a hassle for most people to do because of the stability issues it can bring if it isnt thoroughly tested for 24/48+ hours in a memory testing program.

4400Mhz memory is completely useless for most people and can be worse (latency) than good 3600MHz memory if you just enable XMP because of the decoupled infinity fabric - for intel you need a pretty good imc to run that if im not mistaken too. It is worth it because you can gain lots of performance on zen by tightening the primaries and some of the secondaries, but it can be annoying when diagnosing a problem. Most people will be fine with a 3600MHz kit.

posted about 2 years ago
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