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144hz not always smooth?
posted in Q/A Help
1
#1
3 Frags +

So around two weeks ago I got a 144hz monitor (vg248qe) and it was incredibly smooth on the first day. I've noticed that since then to now, TF2 will feel various levels of smooth. For example, some days in MGE, where I get easily 200+ fps constant, the game will feel like it's running at 75hz or something (my estimate is probably way off). It's certainly not as smooth as I feel like it should be. Other days, it feels wonderful, and it's very noticeable. I play with fps_max 0 and the following net settings cl_cmdrate 100, cl_interp_ratio 1,cl_lagcompensation 1, cl_pred_optimize 2, cl_smooth 0, cl_smoothtime 0.01, cl_updaterate 66, rate 60000. Is there a possibility that my monitor could be downscaling my refresh rate randomly or something? I'm confident that it's not just my eyes playing tricks on me. Possibly related, my old 75hz monitor did the same. I felt like some days the 75hz was VERY smooth and some days it felt really choppy.
Any and all help is appreciated :D

So around two weeks ago I got a 144hz monitor (vg248qe) and it was incredibly smooth on the first day. I've noticed that since then to now, TF2 will feel various levels of smooth. For example, some days in MGE, where I get easily 200+ fps constant, the game will feel like it's running at 75hz or something (my estimate is probably way off). It's certainly not as smooth as I feel like it should be. Other days, it feels wonderful, and it's very noticeable. I play with fps_max 0 and the following net settings cl_cmdrate 100, cl_interp_ratio 1,cl_lagcompensation 1, cl_pred_optimize 2, cl_smooth 0, cl_smoothtime 0.01, cl_updaterate 66, rate 60000. Is there a possibility that my monitor could be downscaling my refresh rate randomly or something? I'm confident that it's not just my eyes playing tricks on me. Possibly related, my old 75hz monitor did the same. I felt like some days the 75hz was VERY smooth and some days it felt really choppy.
Any and all help is appreciated :D
2
#2
0 Frags +

there's some bug about leaving a server with sv_pure 2 enabled and then joining another server. My teammate was having an odd issue like this last night.

there's some bug about leaving a server with sv_pure 2 enabled and then joining another server. My teammate was having an odd issue like this last night.
3
#3
0 Frags +

Do you notice a different feeling on the same server, with the same settings?

Do you notice a different feeling on the same server, with the same settings?
4
#4
0 Frags +
wrechedddddDo you notice a different feeling on the same server, with the same settings?

Yeah it seems random. Same server, same settings, but it feels way different on different days.

[quote=wrecheddddd]Do you notice a different feeling on the same server, with the same settings?[/quote]
Yeah it seems random. Same server, same settings, but it feels way different on different days.
5
#5
0 Frags +
kuzathere's some bug about leaving a server with sv_pure 2 enabled and then joining another server. My teammate was having an odd issue like this last night.

Hm. I'll see if that is what causes it. Sometimes it is just choppyish right out of the gate though (The first server I join when launching tf2 feels not smooth)

[quote=kuza]there's some bug about leaving a server with sv_pure 2 enabled and then joining another server. My teammate was having an odd issue like this last night.[/quote]
Hm. I'll see if that is what causes it. Sometimes it is just choppyish right out of the gate though (The first server I join when launching tf2 feels not smooth)
6
#6
1 Frags +

my game feels stuttery too.

Do you happen to use flux/amd graphics card?

my game feels stuttery too.

Do you happen to use flux/amd graphics card?
7
#7
0 Frags +

Are you running windowed mode? I find that my game will cycle refresh rates for whatever reason when I run windowed borderless.

If you're running flux that could be a problem, I recently discovered that flux would make my game very choppy whenever it would change color temperatures and if I had a browser open.

Are you running windowed mode? I find that my game will cycle refresh rates for whatever reason when I run windowed borderless.

If you're running flux that could be a problem, I recently discovered that flux would make my game very choppy whenever it would change color temperatures and if I had a browser open.
8
#8
0 Frags +
_VikAre you running windowed mode? I find that my game will cycle refresh rates for whatever reason when I run windowed borderless.

If you're running flux that could be a problem, I recently discovered that flux would make my game very choppy whenever it would change color temperatures and if I had a browser open.

This is interesting. I'm curious about this because I use flux as well. Could you elaborate on how you found this out? I always have my color temperature turned down to the lowest, so would I still be affected since the color temperature isn't ever changing?

[quote=_Vik]Are you running windowed mode? I find that my game will cycle refresh rates for whatever reason when I run windowed borderless.

If you're running flux that could be a problem, I recently discovered that flux would make my game very choppy whenever it would change color temperatures and if I had a browser open.[/quote]

This is interesting. I'm curious about this because I use flux as well. Could you elaborate on how you found this out? I always have my color temperature turned down to the lowest, so would I still be affected since the color temperature isn't ever changing?
9
#9
0 Frags +

I use an amd card, a Sapphire 7850. Not sure what flux is. I also run full screen.

I use an amd card, a Sapphire 7850. Not sure what flux is. I also run full screen.
10
#10
0 Frags +

Badabump

Badabump
11
#11
0 Frags +

Use a tool to measure frametime.

Msi Afterburner has monitoring options for frametime and framerate. (and a very nice recording tool :D)
Obviously if the monitor catches the framerate falling below the refresh rate, that's what's causing the issue...
If you see spikes in frametime it could indicate something that amd has to fix with their driver.

Does this happen in other games?
Have you closed all other apps and services?

Use a tool to measure frametime.

[url=http://event.msi.com/vga/afterburner/download.htm]Msi Afterburner[/url] has monitoring options for frametime and framerate. (and a very nice recording tool :D)
Obviously if the monitor catches the framerate falling below the refresh rate, that's what's causing the issue...
If you see spikes in frametime it could indicate something that amd has to fix with their driver.


Does this happen in other games?
Have you closed all other apps and services?
12
#12
0 Frags +

When I first got my monitor it wouldn't do 120Hz in 32bit color and would randomly change down to 100Hz. You can try making a custom monitor profile in your graphics card's control panel with custom settings.

When I first got my monitor it wouldn't do 120Hz in 32bit color and would randomly change down to 100Hz. You can try making a custom monitor profile in your graphics card's control panel with custom settings.
13
#13
0 Frags +
jp_Use a tool to measure frametime.

Msi Afterburner has monitoring options for frametime and framerate. (and a very nice recording tool :D)
Obviously if the monitor catches the framerate falling below the refresh rate, that's what's causing the issue...
If you see spikes in frametime it could indicate something that amd has to fix with their driver.

Does this happen in other games?
Have you closed all other apps and services?

I do run gamebooster, which effectively closes most/all services that I want it to. I notice the not-smoothness even when I am easily keeping my framerate above 200 (MGE servers)

[quote=jp_]Use a tool to measure frametime.

[url=http://event.msi.com/vga/afterburner/download.htm]Msi Afterburner[/url] has monitoring options for frametime and framerate. (and a very nice recording tool :D)
Obviously if the monitor catches the framerate falling below the refresh rate, that's what's causing the issue...
If you see spikes in frametime it could indicate something that amd has to fix with their driver.


Does this happen in other games?
Have you closed all other apps and services?[/quote]
I do run gamebooster, which effectively closes most/all services that I want it to. I notice the not-smoothness even when I am easily keeping my framerate above 200 (MGE servers)
14
#14
0 Frags +
Not_MatlockWhen I first got my monitor it wouldn't do 120Hz in 32bit color and would randomly change down to 100Hz. You can try making a custom monitor profile in your graphics card's control panel with custom settings.

I looked in CCC and I couldn't find anything about custom monitor profiles D:

[quote=Not_Matlock]When I first got my monitor it wouldn't do 120Hz in 32bit color and would randomly change down to 100Hz. You can try making a custom monitor profile in your graphics card's control panel with custom settings.[/quote]
I looked in CCC and I couldn't find anything about custom monitor profiles D:
15
#15
0 Frags +
jp_Does this happen in other games?

?

If not, try adding -nosound to launch options.

delpoNot_MatlockWhen I first got my monitor it wouldn't do 120Hz in 32bit color and would randomly change down to 100Hz. You can try making a custom monitor profile in your graphics card's control panel with custom settings.I looked in CCC and I couldn't find anything about custom monitor profiles D:

Look around in the monitor's OSD, there should be something around there that gives you the refreshrate and resolution.

[quote=jp_]
Does this happen in other games?
[/quote]
?

If not, try adding -nosound to launch options.

[quote=delpo][quote=Not_Matlock]When I first got my monitor it wouldn't do 120Hz in 32bit color and would randomly change down to 100Hz. You can try making a custom monitor profile in your graphics card's control panel with custom settings.[/quote]
I looked in CCC and I couldn't find anything about custom monitor profiles D:[/quote]
Look around in the monitor's OSD, there should be something around there that gives you the refreshrate and resolution.
16
#16
0 Frags +

http://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/

You should go nvidia and do the lightboost hack.

I'd just say make sure your settings in the osd/os are all right and stuff. All drivers up to date. Kill all useless programs. Tweak your graphics for better frames.

http://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/

You should go nvidia and do the lightboost hack.

I'd just say make sure your settings in the osd/os are all right and stuff. All drivers up to date. Kill all useless programs. Tweak your graphics for better frames.
17
#17
0 Frags +
Tombomhttp://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/

You should go nvidia and do the lightboost hack.

I'd just say make sure your settings in the osd/os are all right and stuff. All drivers up to date. Kill all useless programs. Tweak your graphics for better frames.

I'm afraid buying a new gpu is not an option, especially since my current gpu is more than what I need at the moment.

[quote=Tombom]http://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/

You should go nvidia and do the lightboost hack.

I'd just say make sure your settings in the osd/os are all right and stuff. All drivers up to date. Kill all useless programs. Tweak your graphics for better frames.[/quote]
I'm afraid buying a new gpu is not an option, especially since my current gpu is more than what I need at the moment.
18
#18
0 Frags +
Tombomhttp://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/

You should go nvidia and do the lightboost hack.

Is doing this worth it?

[quote=Tombom]http://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/

You should go nvidia and do the lightboost hack.
[/quote]

Is doing this worth it?
19
#19
0 Frags +

-nod3d9ex
it can't hurt

-nod3d9ex
it can't hurt
20
#20
0 Frags +
SolidSpeerlaiyeTombomhttp://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/

You should go nvidia and do the lightboost hack.

Is doing this worth it?

From my experience, no. I did it on a BenQXL2420T.

[quote=SolidSpeerlaiye][quote=Tombom]http://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/

You should go nvidia and do the lightboost hack.
[/quote]

Is doing this worth it?[/quote]
From my experience, no. I did it on a BenQXL2420T.
21
#21
0 Frags +
SolidSpeerlaiyeTombomhttp://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/

You should go nvidia and do the lightboost hack.

Is doing this worth it?

I tried the special Samsung version for my monitor. It does make the picture a lot clearer, but because I had to lower my response time I wasn't able to tell if it really made much of a difference for me. Visually there's no blur, but I'm not sure if it's big of a deal on a 120Hz monitor.

[quote=SolidSpeerlaiye][quote=Tombom]http://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/

You should go nvidia and do the lightboost hack.
[/quote]

Is doing this worth it?[/quote]

I tried the special Samsung version for my monitor. It does make the picture a lot clearer, but because I had to lower my response time I wasn't able to tell if it really made much of a difference for me. Visually there's no blur, but I'm not sure if it's big of a deal on a 120Hz monitor.
22
#22
0 Frags +

From my experience: yes. It really completely eliminates motion blur. Some can deal with it, but I really like CRT quality level refreshing so it means more to me than others.

From my experience: yes. It really completely eliminates motion blur. Some can deal with it, but I really like CRT quality level refreshing so it means more to me than others.
23
#23
0 Frags +

soda popper (always?) stutters with high frequency monitors
and if you're using cl_interp_ratio 1 and you're only getting it on some servers and it's an intermittant thing, try 1.2 instead of 1

soda popper (always?) stutters with high frequency monitors
and if you're using cl_interp_ratio 1 and you're only getting it on some servers and it's an intermittant thing, try 1.2 instead of 1
24
#24
0 Frags +
SolidSpeerlaiyeTombomhttp://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/

You should go nvidia and do the lightboost hack.

Is doing this worth it?

It's preference. Personally I didn't really like it/ think it mattered, but it does reduce blur a bit.

[quote=SolidSpeerlaiye][quote=Tombom]http://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/

You should go nvidia and do the lightboost hack.
[/quote]

Is doing this worth it?[/quote]

It's preference. Personally I didn't really like it/ think it mattered, but it does reduce blur a bit.
25
#25
0 Frags +
killemdeaderSolidSpeerlaiyeTombomhttp://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/
You should go nvidia and do the lightboost hack.
Is doing this worth it?
It's preference. Personally I didn't really like it/ think it mattered, but it does reduce blur a bit.

One very important thing is you REALLY need to run at 120fps @ 120Hz to get true LightBoost benefit.
If you're usually running at only 60fps, LightBoost isn't worth it (doesn't look smoother); running 60fps@120Hz feels more like 30fps@60Hz due to the CRT style double-image effect.

The "CRT clear motion" effect of LightBoost really only shines if fps equals Hz (e.g. 120fps @ 120Hz) or exceeds it, in case of VSYNC OFF.

Some benefits start to show at about 80fps, benefits become clear at 100fps, and stunning at 120fps.
-- May need to reduce your detail level if you don't have GTX 660-league card or better for TF2
-- You also need to get your microstutters under control;
-- A good gaming mouse help prevent mouse from becoming a stutter limitation;
-- You may need to tweak things to make VSYNC OFF smooth looking (or if playing solo, use VSYNC ON);
Then you've eliminated all your weak links to the "CRT zero motion blur" effect.

LightBoost is a stroboscopic backlight that makes LCD behave like a 120 Hz CRT monitor:
(High speed video at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hD5gjAs1A2s ...)
The backlight is turned off between LCD refreshes, to bypass pixel persistence (strobe only on fully refreshed frames, 120 times per second); this makes motion much clearer and looks like a CRT.

Also it benefits faster-motion characters such as the "Scout" character in Team Fortress 2; circle strafing benefits a lot; and fast flick 180-degree turns benefits. You can identify enemies faster during faster motion, because motion blur isn't interfering.

[quote=killemdeader][quote=SolidSpeerlaiye][quote=Tombom]http://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/
You should go nvidia and do the lightboost hack.
[/quote]Is doing this worth it?[/quote]It's preference. Personally I didn't really like it/ think it mattered, but it does reduce blur a bit.[/quote]One very important thing is you REALLY need to run at 120fps @ 120Hz to get true LightBoost benefit.
If you're usually running at only 60fps, LightBoost isn't worth it (doesn't look smoother); running 60fps@120Hz feels more like 30fps@60Hz due to the CRT style double-image effect.

The "CRT clear motion" effect of LightBoost really only shines if fps equals Hz (e.g. 120fps @ 120Hz) or exceeds it, in case of VSYNC OFF.

Some benefits start to show at about 80fps, benefits become clear at 100fps, and stunning at 120fps.
-- May need to reduce your detail level if you don't have GTX 660-league card or better for TF2
-- You also need to get your microstutters under control;
-- A good gaming mouse help prevent mouse from becoming a stutter limitation;
-- You may need to tweak things to make VSYNC OFF smooth looking (or if playing solo, use VSYNC ON);
Then you've eliminated all your weak links to the "CRT zero motion blur" effect.

LightBoost is a stroboscopic backlight that makes LCD behave like a 120 Hz CRT monitor:
(High speed video at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hD5gjAs1A2s ...)
The backlight is turned off between LCD refreshes, to bypass pixel persistence (strobe only on fully refreshed frames, 120 times per second); this makes motion much clearer and looks like a CRT.

Also it benefits faster-motion characters such as the "Scout" character in Team Fortress 2; circle strafing benefits a lot; and fast flick 180-degree turns benefits. You can identify enemies faster during faster motion, because motion blur isn't interfering.
26
#26
0 Frags +

Nice post. Some might be disappointed because at face value, it's not too impressive (I guess? I love it), but as scout I'm looking to get the best quality visual information at all times so lightboost with 120 fps constant is heaven for me.

Nice post. Some might be disappointed because at face value, it's not too impressive (I guess? I love it), but as scout I'm looking to get the best quality visual information at all times so lightboost with 120 fps constant is heaven for me.
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