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PugChamp
posted in Projects
451
#451
ChampGG
6 Frags +

Aborting a draft because circa went scout and you were out picked was probably not a valid reason but w/e

You are right though. We shouldn't be applying bans when we have a cooldown system. The last couple of weeks with the amount of drafts being aborted has made it apparent that we need to increase those cooldowns to deter people that have been abusing it. Unfortunately I am going to hear the wrath of the pug lords again...

As for an appeal system, here works, or using the admin request button OR sending an email to pugchamp@champ.gg is the best way because I don't get spammed to hell with friend requests/messages, and I can make sure the message gets to the right people. I am the only one that controls that email as to ensure anonymity when needed. Until we have a form that goes to our slack automatically, these are the only ways currently.

As for admins, and admin bias it is impossible to remove all bias. It is also hard to find admins who are capable. We have been trialing new admins/gathering references so hopefully our 'circlejerk' (lmao), will be less circle-y. A lot of the admins that were originally brought on do not really play tf2 anymore, or pug so it has be three of us managing the site (myself, and two newer admins who haven't been in the same mumble together for more then 2 hours). I don't even know why I bothered to respond to this because at the end of the day, it is a very thankless job that rewards you with being the most hated person that ever graced tf2. Don't get upset when we get really pissed when someone does dumb shit and thinks its funny.

Aborting a draft because circa went scout and you were out picked was probably not a valid reason but w/e

You are right though. We shouldn't be applying bans when we have a cooldown system. The last couple of weeks with the amount of drafts being aborted has made it apparent that we need to increase those cooldowns to deter people that have been abusing it. Unfortunately I am going to hear the wrath of the pug lords again...

As for an appeal system, here works, or using the admin request button OR sending an email to pugchamp@champ.gg is the best way because I don't get spammed to hell with friend requests/messages, and I can make sure the message gets to the right people. I am the only one that controls that email as to ensure anonymity when needed. Until we have a form that goes to our slack automatically, these are the only ways currently.

As for admins, and admin bias it is impossible to remove all bias. It is also hard to find admins who are capable. We have been trialing new admins/gathering references so hopefully our 'circlejerk' (lmao), will be less circle-y. A lot of the admins that were originally brought on do not really play tf2 anymore, or pug so it has be three of us managing the site (myself, and two newer admins who haven't been in the same mumble together for more then 2 hours). I don't even know why I bothered to respond to this because at the end of the day, it is a very thankless job that rewards you with being the most hated person that ever graced tf2. Don't get upset when we get really pissed when someone does dumb shit and thinks its funny.
452
#452
14 Frags +

it was a pug filled with mostly open players, and me and circa agreed in mumble that i would captain if and only if he didn't play scout (because if he did, it would have been a 5-0 roll because he was the best player added by far). to avoid this since i knew that it would be a roll once circa ended up going scout against our agreement, i killed it. seeing as the site has an auto c-restrict for rolls (plus a site-wide rule that as a captain, you must pick a competitive team), i can't see how this isn't a valid reason to kill a pug

anyway i totally agree that increasing the cooldowns would be an effective deterrent for the massive amounts of pugs that are killed, and keeping it automated gets rid of whatever bias there might be. i had no idea about any of those appeal options (except posting here obviously, but a lot of people may not know that), maybe that information could be displayed on the "you've been restricted" red bar or something so they're more obvious until a true appeal system is added?

erynnI don't even know why I bothered to respond to this because at the end of the day, it is a very thankless job that rewards you with being the most hated person that ever graced tf2. Don't get upset when we get really pissed when someone does dumb shit and thinks its funny.

however, i honestly don't understand this attitude. if you yourself admitted that the ban reason was unjustified, why is getting angry and posting about it a bad thing? i do appreciate all of the work that has gone into the site and would like nothing more than to see it thrive, but there has to be at least some mutual understanding and conversation between the users and the administrators about issues. constructive criticism of your site and how it's run should be something you guys welcome, not resent.

it was a pug filled with mostly open players, and me and circa agreed in mumble that i would captain if and only if he didn't play scout (because if he did, it would have been a 5-0 roll because he was the best player added by far). to avoid this since i knew that it would be a roll once circa ended up going scout against our agreement, i killed it. seeing as the site has an auto c-restrict for rolls (plus a site-wide rule that as a captain, you must pick a competitive team), i can't see how this isn't a valid reason to kill a pug

anyway i totally agree that increasing the cooldowns would be an effective deterrent for the massive amounts of pugs that are killed, and keeping it automated gets rid of whatever bias there might be. i had no idea about any of those appeal options (except posting here obviously, but a lot of people may not know that), maybe that information could be displayed on the "you've been restricted" red bar or something so they're more obvious until a true appeal system is added?

[quote=erynn]I don't even know why I bothered to respond to this because at the end of the day, it is a very thankless job that rewards you with being the most hated person that ever graced tf2. Don't get upset when we get really pissed when someone does dumb shit and thinks its funny.[/quote]

however, i honestly don't understand this attitude. if you yourself admitted that the ban reason was unjustified, why is getting angry and posting about it a bad thing? i do appreciate all of the work that has gone into the site and would like nothing more than to see it thrive, but there has to be at least some mutual understanding and conversation between the users and the administrators about issues. constructive criticism of your site and how it's run should be something you guys welcome, not resent.
453
#453
21 Frags +

http://pastebin.com/f8LMpMSs

http://pastebin.com/f8LMpMSs
454
#454
3 Frags +

^^^^^^

^^^^^^
455
#455
9 Frags +
erynnWe shouldn't be applying bans when we have a cooldown system. The last couple of weeks with the amount of drafts being aborted has made it apparent that we need to increase those cooldowns to deter people that have been abusing it. Unfortunately I am going to hear the wrath of the pug lords again...

you're going to (you have been for 6 months now) hear the wrath of the pug lords until you do one of these things

  • allow admins to manually end drafts & give admin to people who actually play pugs frequently
  • allow captains to end drafts if both of them agree to
  • allow admins (or both captains) to forcibly add or remove players

the fact that admins can add pugs once they're started but not before they've started makes absolutely no sense and this attitude towards making changes to the site doesn't help

erynnI don't even know why I bothered to respond to this because at the end of the day, it is a very thankless job that rewards you with being the most hated person that ever graced tf2. Don't get upset when we get really pissed when someone does dumb shit and thinks its funny.

i get that tsc likes to jerk off over his magnificent ELO system and system of automatically banning/restricting people but I thought you would at least be smart enough to realize the root cause of this problem and address it given how much time you've had
if faceit came out with a pug system similar to pugchamp's (in allowing more than 12 people to add and have captains choose players) i wouldn't be surprised if the site died nearly instantly

[quote=erynn]We shouldn't be applying bans when we have a cooldown system. The last couple of weeks with the amount of drafts being aborted has made it apparent that we need to increase those cooldowns to deter people that have been abusing it. [b]Unfortunately I am going to hear the wrath of the pug lords again[/b]...
[/quote]
you're going to (you have been for 6 months now) hear the wrath of the pug lords until you do one of these things[list]
[*] allow admins to manually end drafts & give admin to people who actually play pugs frequently
[*] allow captains to end drafts if both of them agree to
[*] allow admins (or both captains) to forcibly add or remove players
[/list]
the fact that admins can add pugs once they're started but not before they've started makes absolutely no sense and this attitude towards making changes to the site doesn't help
[quote=erynn]I don't even know why I bothered to respond to this because at the end of the day, it is a very thankless job that rewards you with being the most hated person that ever graced tf2. Don't get upset when we get really pissed when someone does dumb shit and thinks its funny.[/quote]
i get that tsc likes to jerk off over his magnificent ELO system and system of automatically banning/restricting people but I thought you would at least be smart enough to realize the root cause of this problem and address it given how much time you've had
if faceit came out with a pug system similar to pugchamp's (in allowing more than 12 people to add and have captains choose players) i wouldn't be surprised if the site died nearly instantly
456
#456
-20 Frags +

Alright I literally just got permabanned for no reason, I reported someone who wouldn't talk in mumble and got banned for it, then I got banned cause tatuwah quoted something that I literally didn't say to kawa and now im permad. I tried to add her and she didn't accept, I don't understand how I did anything wrong, or why the admins don't try and get more than one side of the story. Can I at least talk to someone instead of just getting completely shut out for absolutey no reason ?

Alright I literally just got permabanned for no reason, I reported someone who wouldn't talk in mumble and got banned for it, then I got banned cause tatuwah quoted something that I literally didn't say to kawa and now im permad. I tried to add her and she didn't accept, I don't understand how I did anything wrong, or why the admins don't try and get more than one side of the story. Can I at least talk to someone instead of just getting completely shut out for absolutey no reason ?
457
#457
-21 Frags +

This literally goes back to the same thing that happened to laz, I did absolutely nothing that goes against the rules of the website, then I get permabanned without a single chance to plead my case simply because I am not an invite player/friends with any admins. Plus, why would I asked to get permad if I play on the website like everyday, I would think that you might have the deduction skills to at least take a second look at what was said, instead of just banning me forever because you got upset kawa.

This literally goes back to the same thing that happened to laz, I did absolutely nothing that goes against the rules of the website, then I get [b]perma[/b]banned without a single chance to plead my case simply because I am not an invite player/friends with any admins. Plus, why would I asked to get permad if I play on the website like everyday, I would think that you might have the deduction skills to at least take a second look at what was said, instead of just banning me forever because you got upset kawa.
458
#458
21 Frags +
TamboAlright I literally just got permabanned for no reason, I reported someone who wouldn't talk in mumble and got banned for it, then I got banned cause tatuwah quoted something that I literally didn't say to kawa and now im permad. I tried to add her and she didn't accept, I don't understand how I did anything wrong, or why the admins don't try and get more than one side of the story. Can I at least talk to someone instead of just getting completely shut out for absolutey no reason ?

This is total bullshit lol. He subbed me for not healing him after he called me brainless and autistic and told me to shut the fuck up when I asked him to wait up so I could run to the next point with him. I told him the same when he asked for heals and after a few seconds gave him a full buff anyway. Then he subbed his entire team other than tatuwah before the game even ended but yeah I'm sure he was banned for no reason

[quote=Tambo]Alright I literally just got permabanned for no reason, I reported someone who wouldn't talk in mumble and got banned for it, then I got banned cause tatuwah quoted something that I literally didn't say to kawa and now im permad. I tried to add her and she didn't accept, I don't understand how I did anything wrong, or why the admins don't try and get more than one side of the story. Can I at least talk to someone instead of just getting completely shut out for absolutey no reason ?[/quote]

This is total bullshit lol. He subbed me for not healing him after he called me brainless and autistic and told me to shut the fuck up when I asked him to wait up so I could run to the next point with him. I told him the same when he asked for heals and after a few seconds gave him a full buff anyway. Then he subbed his entire team other than tatuwah before the game even ended but yeah I'm sure he was banned for no reason
459
#459
-19 Frags +
IggynacioTamboAlright I literally just got permabanned for no reason, I reported someone who wouldn't talk in mumble and got banned for it, then I got banned cause tatuwah quoted something that I literally didn't say to kawa and now im permad. I tried to add her and she didn't accept, I don't understand how I did anything wrong, or why the admins don't try and get more than one side of the story. Can I at least talk to someone instead of just getting completely shut out for absolutey no reason ?
This is total bullshit lol. He subbed me for not healing him after he called me brainless and autistic and told me to shut the fuck up when I asked him to wait up so I could run to the next point with him. I told him the same when he asked for heals and after a few seconds gave him a full buff anyway. Then he subbed his entire team other than tatuwah before the game even ended but yeah I'm sure he was banned for no reason

That's not true at all, that was the second pug in a row you got upset and stopped talking after like 5 minutes, plus you stopped healing me completely in both games for longer than 5 seconds, whilst still not talking. You also called me toxic two games in a row because you thought I was talking to you when I mostly wasn't.

[quote=Iggynacio][quote=Tambo]Alright I literally just got permabanned for no reason, I reported someone who wouldn't talk in mumble and got banned for it, then I got banned cause tatuwah quoted something that I literally didn't say to kawa and now im permad. I tried to add her and she didn't accept, I don't understand how I did anything wrong, or why the admins don't try and get more than one side of the story. Can I at least talk to someone instead of just getting completely shut out for absolutey no reason ?[/quote]

This is total bullshit lol. He subbed me for not healing him after he called me brainless and autistic and told me to shut the fuck up when I asked him to wait up so I could run to the next point with him. I told him the same when he asked for heals and after a few seconds gave him a full buff anyway. Then he subbed his entire team other than tatuwah before the game even ended but yeah I'm sure he was banned for no reason[/quote]

That's not true at all, that was the second pug in a row you got upset and stopped talking after like 5 minutes, plus you stopped healing me completely in both games for longer than 5 seconds, whilst still not talking. You also called me toxic two games in a row because you thought I was talking to you when I mostly wasn't.
460
#460
24 Frags +

why the fuck would you sub a medic out while you're winning AND while he's giving you more heals than the scouts on the other team are getting you fucking retard

why the fuck would you sub a medic out while you're winning AND while he's giving you more heals than the scouts on the other team are getting you fucking retard
461
#461
15 Frags +
TamboThat's not true at all, that was the second pug in a row you got upset and stopped talking after like 5 minutes, plus you stopped healing me completely in both games for longer than 5 seconds, whilst still not talking. You also called me toxic two games in a row because you thought I was talking to you when I mostly wasn't.

Oh no, no heals for 5 whole seconds!

[quote=Tambo]That's not true at all, that was the second pug in a row you got upset and stopped talking after like 5 minutes, plus you stopped healing me completely in both games for longer than 5 seconds, whilst still not talking. You also called me toxic two games in a row because you thought I was talking to you when I mostly wasn't.[/quote]

Oh no, no heals for 5 whole seconds!
462
#462
14 Frags +

I don't ever just stop talking or playing during games, I don't get upset like that over dumb shit. I called him toxic the first time after he said I had "some kind of sandwich autism"(?), called my arrows shit, and told me to stop using my brain cause it was useless. The second time was after he kicked me so I feel that was justified.

I don't ever just stop talking or playing during games, I don't get upset like that over dumb shit. I called him toxic the first time after he said I had "some kind of sandwich autism"(?), called my arrows shit, and told me to stop using my brain cause it was useless. The second time was after he kicked me so I feel that was justified.
463
#463
-18 Frags +

Even if you disagree with the reason and setting in which I subbed him, even though it was acceptable according to the rules, it's no reason for a permaban. I was banned because someone in chat said that I asked to be, which was a complete lie. I'll take the 3 day if it's against the rules to kick someone from the game from the game late, but the perma is unjustified.

Even if you disagree with the reason and setting in which I subbed him, even though it was acceptable according to the rules, it's no reason for a permaban. I was banned because someone in chat said that I asked to be, which was a complete lie. I'll take the 3 day if it's against the rules to kick someone from the game from the game late, but the perma is unjustified.
464
#464
19 Frags +

tambo told me to tell kawa that "kawa tambo said you should unban him"

and i mistyped and said "kawa tambo said you're retarded and to permaban him"

honest mistake im sorry

tambo told me to tell kawa that "kawa tambo said you should unban him"

and i mistyped and said "kawa tambo said you're retarded and to permaban him"

honest mistake im sorry
465
#465
19 Frags +

It's almost as if when you act like a massive asshole to just about everyone you interact with that people find it hard to sympathize. Online video games is a social environment. I'm not sure why some people can't see that it's important to not just be good at the game but (perhaps moreso) how you treat people too. With that in mind, comparing yourself to laz is like comparing a turd to a diamond.

It's almost as if when you act like a massive asshole to just about everyone you interact with that people find it hard to sympathize. Online video games is a social environment. I'm not sure why some people can't see that it's important to not just be good at the game but (perhaps moreso) how you treat people too. With that in mind, comparing yourself to laz is like comparing a turd to a diamond.
466
#466
4 Frags +

ok sure hes a giant asshole

but i literally lied about what he asked me to say for him so he really shouldnt be permad

he def deserves the 3 day ban though hes autistic

ok sure hes a giant asshole

but i literally lied about what he asked me to say for him so he really shouldnt be permad

he def deserves the 3 day ban though hes autistic
467
#467
7 Frags +

ok i got banned for 12 hours for aborting a draft because b4nny and johnmilter got afk'd
thanks tsc im glad you guys made the pointless penalty even more harsh instead of fixing your horse shit site

ok i got banned for 12 hours for aborting a draft because b4nny and johnmilter got afk'd
thanks tsc im glad you guys made the pointless penalty even more harsh instead of fixing your horse shit site
468
#468
5 Frags +

maybe before you create a whole new elo system you could do one of these things

bearodactyl
  • allow admins to manually end drafts & give admin to people who actually play pugs frequently
  • allow captains to end drafts if both of them agree to
  • allow admins (or both captains) to forcibly add or remove players

Banning people manually after they get automatic cooldowns is retarded, not only is it redundant but it's a waste of time. In addition, if regular captains can't captain, people have to wait longer for somebody to captain, which makes the experience worse for everybody. I can't believe you guys are still surprised you are getting hate.

maybe before you create a whole new elo system you could do one of these things
[quote=bearodactyl][list]
[*] allow admins to manually end drafts & give admin to people who actually play pugs frequently
[*] allow captains to end drafts if both of them agree to
[*] allow admins (or both captains) to forcibly add or remove players
[/list][/quote]
Banning people manually after they get automatic cooldowns is retarded, not only is it redundant but it's a waste of time. In addition, if regular captains can't captain, people have to wait longer for somebody to captain, which makes the experience worse for everybody. I can't believe you guys are still surprised you are getting hate.
469
#469
-12 Frags +

#freetambo

#freetambo
470
#470
-14 Frags +

how long until someone creates a site named pugstadium and markets it as the same as pugchamp but with cooler menu colors and better admins

how long until someone creates a site named pugstadium and markets it as the same as pugchamp but with cooler menu colors and better admins
471
#471
7 Frags +
Vegan_Meathow long until someone creates a site named pugstadium and markets it as the same as pugchamp but with cooler menu colors and better admins

that's an awful name and an awful joke

[quote=Vegan_Meat]how long until someone creates a site named pugstadium and markets it as the same as pugchamp but with cooler menu colors and better admins[/quote]
that's an awful name and an awful joke
472
#472
-17 Frags +

Okay, it's been 3 days, by original ban is lifted and the permaban has been shown to be unjust, can I please be unrestricted as I did literally nothing to get permad.

Okay, it's been 3 days, by original ban is lifted and the permaban has been shown to be unjust, can I please be unrestricted as I did literally nothing to get permad.
473
#473
2 Frags +

my pugchamp mumble is always laggy and disconnecting!!! pls help!

my pugchamp mumble is always laggy and disconnecting!!! pls help!
474
#474
ChampGG
6 Frags +
Marmaloomy pugchamp mumble is always laggy and disconnecting!!! pls help!

We are in the process of getting a new one. Hopefully tonight

[quote=Marmaloo]my pugchamp mumble is always laggy and disconnecting!!! pls help![/quote]

We are in the process of getting a new one. Hopefully tonight
475
#475
3 Frags +

:D

:D
476
#476
0 Frags +

Is it just me or can I not change my alias in either pugchamp or mixchamp? Tried on both Chrome and Firefox.

Is it just me or can I not change my alias in either pugchamp or mixchamp? Tried on both Chrome and Firefox.
477
#477
-1 Frags +

once you have your alias set you cant change it unless you message an admin

once you have your alias set you cant change it unless you message an admin
478
#478
6 Frags +

why the fuck is reckoner still in the NA rotation when no relevant NA league plays it and 90% of people dont want to pug on it

why the fuck is reckoner still in the NA rotation when no relevant NA league plays it and 90% of people dont want to pug on it
479
#479
2 Frags +

i have yet to play an enjoyable pug on reckoner

i have yet to play an enjoyable pug on reckoner
480
#480
-29 Frags +

pugchamp's priorities are completely out of whack. like instead of adding fadds/fremoves or doing stuff people actually want tsc is busy tweaking custom sounds and shit. we don't want that. we want an actual functioning service. i do not understand how you can fail harder than valve at actually using your ear holes to listen to people talk; at least valve has the excuse of being an actual corporation abstracted in some form away from its users. pugchamp is right here on TFTV and i'm finding it increasingly hard to believe that they aren't just slapping their hands over their ears and going "LALALALALALA" every time someone posts here. it's actually fucking insane and has honestly destroyed the opinions i had of erynn and tsc.

please, just add fadds and fremoves instead of creating an ELO system for a pug website. i beg you. it cannot be this hard.

pugchamp's priorities are completely out of whack. like instead of adding fadds/fremoves or doing stuff people actually want tsc is busy tweaking custom sounds and shit. we don't want that. we want an actual functioning service. i do not understand how you can fail harder than valve at actually using your ear holes to listen to people talk; at least valve has the excuse of being an actual corporation abstracted in some form away from its users. pugchamp is right here on TFTV and i'm finding it increasingly hard to believe that they aren't just slapping their hands over their ears and going "LALALALALALA" every time someone posts here. it's actually fucking insane and has honestly destroyed the opinions i had of erynn and tsc.

please, just add fadds and fremoves instead of creating an ELO system for a pug website. i beg you. it cannot be this hard.
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