Personally I still think this map is pretty good and should be played more. The only advice I can give you is ask for feedback earlier. Last season ended more than one month ago, and next season is already starting in two weeks. So it might be a bit too late to ask for feedback and implement that before next season starts. Pretty sure ETF2L even needs to announce the map pool within one week because the prem qualifiers will be next week, so that's even less time to make changes on the map.

It's weird that we haven't tried out Propaganda or Reckoner in the last preseason map cups. I think it would be a good idea to do a preseason map cup of these maps next season.

I do like the idea to have 9 maps. Maybe keep the current map pool and add Badlands and Metalworks. Next season we can compare these maps with Propaganda or Reckoner hopefully.

https://clips.twitch.tv/CaringBusyIguanaHumbleLife

https://clips.twitch.tv/FancyDepressedPepperEleGiggle

a balance between competitive and fun is subjective, but when is something considered OP? isn't that a bit subjective as well?

I wouldn't say lack of support, there was almost no point to play these cups. If these cups were in evening (and maybe different days), more teams/mixes would probably join because they were going to play anyway around that time.

My only experience is that for one cup, we only played 4 games from 4pm until 8.30pm. So waiting time was around 2 hours, and in the end the best thing you could get is ESL premium. Pretty sure that almost nobody is playing to get esl premium.

Several people helped (in ESL discord) to come up with other ideas to get more teams involved. One of the ideas was to give out medals to all the participants. This is probably one of the easiest ideas to implement, and it will give players a reason to play at 4pm on a Sunday and potentially wait a long time between games. However, you/ESL said: "We didn't want to just give medals out like crazy, we wanted to make sure that the medal was kept moderately rare and had to be challenging to get it, hence why it's the monthly challenge!"

So ESL made the decision to keep the medal rare over keeping the cups alive. Imo that's just ESL not willing to invest in TF2, not a lack of support in the EU community.

I preferred logjam over prolands and maybe even granary. It would be fair to give maps like metalworks another chance, although I would prefer to see reckoner for example.

As Hyce said, maybe it would be good to point out what's wrong with the maps that weren't liked. You can keep adding different maps, but if the mapmakers don't get feedback you have to rotate maps every season because these maps won't improve.

Maybe it's an idea to do reruns of these streams during more Europe friendly times?

not defending ry but you've been on a team with him? http://etf2l.org/teams/31343/

guess who's on that team as well that posted in this thread not that long ago...

You just want your medal :3

ETF2L has a rule for that: http://etf2l.org/rules/general-rules/#2 (2.9)

Agreed. I don't know about the cheating part, but if he's allowed to play you can't just call it sandbagging. He's just following the rules. Almost every player from the team that got first place in the previous Fresh Meat challenge, or even the teams that played the finals of Archimedes Cup played div1/2 afterwards.

https://clips.twitch.tv/StylishAmazingNightingaleCoolStoryBob
https://clips.twitch.tv/LuckyPopularClintmullinsJKanStyle

https://clips.twitch.tv/TastyFrailHippoMoreCowbell