there is no need to trip. i believe admins re-created it recently

gimmick accounts should at least be interesting

if you think they're safe to fuck you got another thing comin mister. always beware

https://puu.sh/CNw3c/f8245e8a9b.jpg

Happy Birthday Bdonski! The Birthday Boy is pictured here holding the 3rd Place Medal from the first ever Rewind LAN in Santa Ana

how's this https://puu.sh/CMvZf/70c60eaacf.jpg

as the others say, low-res images aren't going to look as good. that's why i stayed away from the other cover, it looks like it'll blow up like shit; it's already really blurry and full of artifacting

I see it a bit in the second photo but it could be mostly the melancholy facial expression

give him time dude

No.

The league is fine, I encourage everyone to take part if they think it'll be fun. People enjoy the other RGL leagues - I've said this many times lately and mean it. My take on the league is irrelevant because I don't play.

A main selling point is literally that data will be sent to Valve. This is outlined very specifically on the website. And I see people coming out of the woodwork in this thread like "Well hey, it can't hurt."

My stance is very simple - sounds good but don't sell folks on Valve doing something with data if you're totally making that up and haven't spoken to Valve about it first. This is not a major piece of it, this doesn't hold up the league, it's not a crime etc, and sure you can do positive shit without Valve. But if folks are going to give their time and effort to this because they are being led to believe that Valve will get data, and that will somehow do something, I just hope they can find out NOW if it's not true or correct, rather than at season's end.

And sure, many people may not care about that! Maybe nobody cares, maybe everyone's happy to play whether or not anything will happen - I'm sure many will and that's cool. But with "improving competitive" and "the future of competitive" and all these buzzwords being thrown around.. I mean "Valve gets data and improves our game" is the ultimate pipe dream, and has been for 10 years, right? People will buy into this really fucking easily and quickly - it's close to our hearts. I think it's fair for players to want to know whether it's BS or not.

And absolutely, if nobody cares at all, then I'll shut up. But I think this is a fair thing to want details on. If the season is finished and we send over.. whatever data, I guess the survey details or whatever, and Valve says like "Uh we don't have enough people, we can't do anything with this even if we want to" well.. that will be shitty for everyone involved and probably the scene as a whole.

Since you didn't answer it here, let me ask - Have you spoken to Valve (recently)? Do you know that they have any use for information like this? Have you asked how realistic it is to expect them to do anything with it? Do you know what plans they may have, or where their head is at? I believe it's naive to say you'll give them all this information and that it will lead to "something positive" if you don't actually know that for sure. I would want something more than "maybe" at this point. I think it's reasonable for others to also want to know this. Saying "sure they're interested, they gave us matchmaking right?" doesn't cut it.

Good point. I guess I was more just giving him an opening to share any discussion he may have had, or what the latest is. Rather than just saying "We know what the answer is".

But this had a positive effect overall, because you are very clearly one of those people who WOULD know better than anyone. Which goes towards responding to lucrative's point of (and sorry I have to paraphrase and simplify it) "How do we know if we don't ask/try" or "People who don't know anything should stop commenting" etc

What up dude, I respect you a ton. And actually, you make good points about people shooting themselves in the foot, about close-minded people, about people bullshitting etc.

But like.. here's the way some of us look at it. Matchmaking started to come around in 2015, and that was also the same year we saw skins introduced, and a bunch of other shit that seemed exciting. Then 2016 was the year we all got to try matchmaking. That year, many streamers and community folks, we were TALKING TO VALVE like very consistently - Jill appeared, friended many of us on Steam, watched our streams very frequently, and showed up in Twitch chat a lot, as well as here and in other places. Made it clear Valve HQ was watching our streams, and looking at whatever improvements were needed. He wanted feedback, info, data, etc. And as I recall, that was a big part of their messaging around that time - "We're collecting data during this Matchmaking BETA" - remember that? The beta that you needed a pass to take part in? That's about 3 years ago this month.

So now it's 2019. And it's hard not to realize.. like look, Valve doesn't talk to us anymore, at all, and hasn't in years. And also they stopped putting out updates. There was supposed to be a Heavy update, but I wouldn't expect that to ship. And also, some of the best most talented, skilled people, guys who put thousands of their own dollars into this game, people like Lange and dashner and Sideshow/Bren and Arie and Byte and Sal and cbear (and others).. they've been gone for YEARS. And their efforts only worked up to a certain point - yes we have great production value now and great plugins still kinda, and a cool tournament in England once a year plus a couple other events, but.. the GAME, the SCENE has gone nowhere. Can you show me any of the good that sending Valve data years ago has done? Yes, we get a balance pass once a year or two. That's just a paint-job though.

So my perspective is not one of negativity or disdain or pessimism, it's more like "Well the best people we've ever had busted their fuckin asses for almost 10 years and if that didn't work, and we don't really have people like that around anymore, then maybe we just have fun and do what we can until they shut down the servers." And I see that as more realism than it is cynicism. AND, I perceive that people are kinda in that mode now. People still DM and MGE every day and I think that's great, and I respect that people still care that much. I'm glad they play in serious pay leagues, and less serious free leagues.

We haven't spoken to Valve in years now. Beyond messaging them to get an event blast in-game or a blog post. But I can tell you with a fair degree of certainty that nobody at Valve is waiting on a pile of data so they can improve competitive 6v6 in TF2. Even if they got it, there is zero manpower to do anything, and basically zero incentive. Again, I would love to be proven wrong, but there comes a point when the evidence is just overwhelming. From a business standpoint, all Valve has to do is pay the light bill and throw a community holiday update a few times a year. And that's where they've been at for a while. It's sad sure, and it's disappointing sure, but the best thing to do is make the best of it. People aren't shutting this down fully out of pessimism (not most people anyway) - it's actually very rooted in reality and history and precedent.

Folks who played in the 7v7 league tend to say they enjoyed it, and that it's fun. So let the kids keep having fun; it's a fun-ass game and that's where we both started, having fun. But let's not put too much stock in the idea that "Sending Valve Data" is the only thing holding us back from a major and player stickers and prize money and "legitimacy" as a top-tier esport.

EDIT: Here's an idea. Maybe we just ASK Valve if they have any use for data, and try to get some realistic expectations of what they want, and what they may be capable of doing with it. sigafoo, if you've had talks with them, this would be a great time to mention that and give all the details. If not, it might be a great time to do so. Credit to artichoke for the fairly obvious idea.

I'm glad this will give folks a chance to have some fun, and I hope it's enjoyable to play and etc

But the idea of passing 6v6 data on to Valve in February 2019 is beyond silly. You're living in a fantasy land if that's your idea. I can't imagine something more out of touch with reality.

Ditch that piece, have your fun league, stop trying to pretend competitive can LEAD anywhere or BECOME something. Enjoy it for what it is - just enjoy the fact that there's a fun league where you can play with your friends unless you win Invite every year, fuck around with unlocks, treat it like 4v4 and just have fun. There's definitely a place for this, but don't make it weird by pretending it's leading to some greater good and some 6v6 breakthrough and all these dreams we had in 2014.

my crush asked to go to the bathroom before me, i went like 5 minutes later, and i only peed, but somehow SHE WAS BACK BEFORE ME? so i'm pretty sure she pees standing up that's all any of the boys have been able to figure out

I don't want this to just be an idea and then have no action, that's what always happens

Who can spearhead killing kaidus please? Let's make sure we get this done

look at this dude's steam profile if you want to see a complete idiot