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Signed Up October 28, 2012
Last Posted January 21, 2020 at 8:38 PM
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#7 lfp high im in Recruitment (looking for players)

Faust surprised me with how solid his pocket was last season. He can definitely squish IM!

posted about 2 years ago
#227 nerf pyro in TF2 General Discussion
funhaver1998everything in the game should be balanced at every level and in every gamemode and its 100% possible and not even hard. like gunboats or scout (i kno a lot of ppl will have trouble understanding that one, but i dont mind explaining)

Yeah, you go right ahead and do that.

in the situation where gink was in house and insta kills thalash, hes outnumbered, has 18 hp and in some retarded situation but still manages to kill someone

even after gink had died

and theres a health pack like right there but it was so fast that despite the scouts move speed he couldnt even reach it, and thats thalash, not some pub scout, hes better than u as well as most of these stupid ass clips happening to the best team in europe but i guess they just lack the skills u do

now thats a cherry picked situation cause its bat shit retarded thats even happening, but the point is that it could happen and some kind of retardation happens all the time now that people are just switching to pyro at random times without any thought usually just because they are bored and then end up reflecting a rocket into a med with uber or killing like 3 people without really understanding what they're doing themselves, they're just bored and walking forward

Do you not see the irony that you're telling me I can't criticize Thalash because he's better than me, while criticizing me, while I'm better than you?

Nobody is perfect and even the best players make mistakes constantly. If you think that top level players don't make mistakes, or they don't make mistakes that people worse than them can recognize, I don't even know what to tell you.

He didn't die because he was too slow, he died because he walked into the flamethrower. It was easily preventable and he fucked up, the end.

these ppl making these vids arent trying to show us how they out brained the other team, gink and dark necrid and all the other ppl making these vids are just showing all the dumb and shitty stuff u can just get away with now

What the video's author intended is irrelevant. The fact of the matter is that they succeeded because the Pyro's victims fucked up incredibly simple things, like, for instance, walking into a Phlog Pyro when he has crits, or not juggling a Pyro who can't airblast and is holding W.

if this update came out in 2009 tf2 wouldn't of got to where it is today, not only because of what its done to 6s but mainly what its done to pubs. the reason why my last post was significant was because pubbers have gotten worse like a lot worse because they rely on this shit a lot more and they end up with like -6 k/ds and struggle and rage in chat when their shit doesn't work. when i was pubbing and shit it wasn't like that at all and ppl were always trying to do new shit like new rocket jumps and trick stabs what have u but now if you pub and u see someone doing that its just a competitive player u recognise from somewhere else.

wat this leads to is no players coming to play comp because they understand that they aren't good enough to despite knowing what comp is now. the average pubber now knows what comp is most likely because as a youtuber and twitch streamer b4nny has pretty much replaced the role star_ had, moreso on twitch, like if u have the word like 'b4nny' in your name or 'lft', a pubber nowadays will know what that is and understand that you are a comp level player and thats how they understand why you're better, but if u don't and you're doing well, you're a hacker, because the skillfloor of the pubber has decreased by that much.

and ofc, the perception of the game changes when people see all this dumb shit happening. people have kind of just accepted that tf2 isn't going anywhere so theres not really any debate, but there used to be, as in ppl from my school would play CS and stuff would say the usual 'this game is for children and its easy' and then u would show them some MGE or shadowburn frag vid and they wouldn't think like that anymore, but if they saw gink's vid they would go back to how they were thinking before.

Here is STAR's most popular video.


Show your friends this and ask them if TF2 looks like a competitive game.

I also don't understand where you're going with this. Iatgink doesn't have the following of Banny or STAR, and if they watched Banny today they'd be far more likely to appreciate competitive TF2 than if they watched STAR's youtube in 2009 or whatever. I can find hundreds of videos that depict TF2 as a silly casual game from 2009 that have at least as many views as that Pyro clip.

As for the argument that there are less competitive players in pubs which leads to less awareness of competitive TF2 in pubs, it's far more likely due to the horribleness of Casual matchmaking and the death of community servers stopping competitive players from pubbing. That's what's deterred me and most people I know who have taken a step back from pubbing.

u can pretend like no one thinks that about TF2 all u want but its very very common that ppl think that way about this game and this pyro shit isn't helping whatsoever, its actually making no part of the game better than it was before the update and 90% of the community as well as myself would much rather be playing the game before the update

I would too. That doesn't equate to banning Pyro.

ya, u can just press s but thats not fun and not needed in the game. its one dimensional as much as it makes the pyro ineffective and awkward that you have to adjust your own play style just to fight this class and that everyone has to adjust it in the same plain and boring way.


ya, u can just press s but thats not fun

I don't think I need to go any further.

posted about 2 years ago
#225 nerf pyro in TF2 General Discussion
JynxiiI am by no means a low level player, medic requires brain > pyro doesnt.

Pyro takes significantly more thought than Medic. Pyro has to make difficult decisions constantly because you are leading pushes or alone, and is punished harder for positioning errors because of the opportunity cost of not running Pyro and slower speed. Meanwhile, everything a Medic needs to think about can be microd for him, and he can brainlessly follow whoever is leading the push like a dog on a leash. I guarantee every player who reads tftv can play Medic at the same or higher level than they can their combat class main after a few weeks of practice. I would not say the same of Pyro.

spy dies after getting one kill > pyro doesnt. Sentry guns cant get ubered and run into an entire enemy team > pyro can.

If your team has lost multiple people to a Pyro Uber, or worse, a Pyro sac, then I have no sympathy for you and you deserve to lose. He has shit approach tools and walks too slow to catch any 6s class. How the fuck do you ever let that happen? Your argument was that Pyro should be banned because killing people doesn't take mechanical skill. Surely, any person to die to something that takes no mechanical skill is a tragedy that we must never allow to happen again, since this is an FPS, and aim is sacred, right?

Competitive tf2 is balanced around keeping the players' skills as the focal point and removing aspects of the game that give large advantages with little to no effort or counterplay (i.e wrangler, Sydney sleeper). Pyro gets rewarded for being within 5ft of an enemy that isnt invulnerable.

Yes, but the difference is there's quite a bit of counterplay. For example, staying five feet away, and/or being invulnerable.

I know that it does get used as a scapegoat for things going poorly in game quite often, but when almost every single tf2 player that has any understanding of the game (even pubbers) complain about it being too easy and unfun to play against, simply saying 'git gud press S XD' isnt enough to quell the frustrations that it will continue to bring.


Pubbers think Sniper and Scout are bad, that Heavy is mandatory, and that Soldier is overpowered. They've also been bitching about Pyro as long as Pyro has existed, even when it was utter garbage.

If you have to stoop as low as saying that you're right because the lowest common denominator of X category agrees with you, your argument is lacking.

I guarantee you do not want to play the version of 6v6 that pubbers imagine to be ideal. Seriously.

posted about 2 years ago
#222 nerf pyro in TF2 General Discussion

It does not take skill to press S and check corners. This is not a technique exclusive to high level players, anyone can do it.

Are we balancing for the skill floor now? Medic is significantly easier than Pyro with a much lower skill ceiling. Building Sentry Guns also takes zero skill. And Spy is capable of instagibbing any class with no mechanical skill, if they don't play around Spy existing.

Competitive 6v6 has never balanced with the mindset of protecting low level players from their idiocy. I hope that will never change.

Also, you said this:

Jynxiiif a class it at the point at which a team has to have an 8 second solo uber (on the same class i.e pyro vs pyro) to counter it, then it has to be considered quite absurd

Implying that the only way to counter [Phlog] Pyro is with another Pyro. This is what I am disproving.

posted about 2 years ago
#220 nerf pyro in TF2 General Discussion
Jynxiisolo ubering a standard class against a pyro means you lose once the uber has ended because he can obliterate anyone but another pyro who kills him first. Fun.

No, because the Phlog Pyro's Medic popped much earlier.

If you take it a step forward and say, "well, what if the defending team lets the Pyro walk onto point uncontested?" And the answer to that would be, "Then they would have a much better chance of capping last if the Pyro had airblast, and that defending team would have lost the cap to pre-JI Pyro anyway."

posted about 2 years ago
#218 nerf pyro in TF2 General Discussion
JynxiiA pyro can be ubered and still do its full damage potential while moving at the max movement speed for that class, heavy has to spin up and slow himself down making him easy to run away from, and all of engineers effectiveness comes from his sentry is almost all cases. Those comparisons are useless to make and prove nothing for your argument

Your argument is that Pyro is not easy to run away from because he can run at 100% speed.

In 6s.

Think about that for a second.

Also Powerjack is obviously terrible as an approach tool and Detonator is extremely mediocre. It's the equivalent of doing a minimum damage rocket jump as a gap closer. They are passable at getting from place to place, but that doesn't matter if you can't get kills without the enemy team donating them to you.

(also i edited previous post to respond to you in case you miss it)

posted about 2 years ago
#216 nerf pyro in TF2 General Discussion
AlexandrosThe problem with pyro isn't that it's pyro. The problem isn't that it's completely unable to be countered. The problem is that far too much work and effort has to be put in to counter something that requires very little work and effort to use. The reason it's broken is that it basically guarantees a trade or better for any class in the game for little to no aim required, and the trade is assuming the class it's fighting hits every shot.

The trade is assuming that the class that is faster walks into range of a class that is slower. Going Pyro is not a guaranteed trade or people would sac on Pyro.

I don't understand how you can be so deluded. Have any of you actually played 6s Pyro for more than a handful of lives post-JI update? If you get a guaranteed trade every time you go in as Pyro, I have a spot on my Invite team for you.

Yes, killing people with the Flamethrower is easy if you get into range. What nobody seems to understand is that if you get into range of a slow, short range class with bad mobility you have already fucked up and deserve to die. You can apply everything you said about Pyro to talk about Engineer or Heavy, but neither of them are overpowered, because they're limited by their mobility, their range, and by the opposing team's capacity to not walk into their optimal range when they could just not do that. Not walking into range of a turtle class is not mechanically difficult, I have no doubt that every player on every team in Open has an S key.

Your suggestions are awful, but I'm not going to address them because they're irrelevant. I'm seriously questioning if you've ever touched Pyro if you think that giving him 40 ammo will fix anything though.

JynxiiTo clear up the first clip in gink's video (im on the team that got owned on gully) we had a miscommunication between our pyro and our medic leading to him getting dropped which means we could have dealt with it better than we did. I'll give you that. But if a class it at the point at which a team has to have an 8 second solo uber (on the same class i.e pyro vs pyro) to counter it, then it has to be considered quite absurd

They could literally have solo Ubered any standard class and done the same thing.

The argument was that Phlog and/or Pyro is overpowered because in this video, a team pushing last with Phlog Pyro one time succesfully, and there was no way to counter that. I'm telling you how to counter it. If you want to continue arguing that the Phlog and/or Pyro are overpowered, you need to make a new argument.

posted about 2 years ago
#213 nerf pyro in TF2 General Discussion

It's been an entire season. If it's such an auto-win button that can only can be countered by running your own Pyro or a Sniper, where is the plague of unstoppable Pyros ravaging Open?

I don't have the CS knowledge to refute your analogy, but I feel like there's a fundamental difference between a very strong hitscan weapon and JI Pyro. The difference is you counter a hitscan weapon by aiming better, which is mechanically difficult. You counter Pyro by pressing S and taking corners wide, which is not difficult.

You also have to think of the cost. As I understand it (correct me if I'm wrong), nobody was using the gun before and so banning it costed the metagame nothing. There is a real cost in banning Pyro that affects every team and every player in the division. Don't minimize that.

posted about 2 years ago
#210 nerf pyro in TF2 General Discussion
povbtw the prosposed change to ban pyro is temporary until an actual fix to the class' botched update comes out. not that we should ban pyro forever

I know.

posted about 2 years ago
#207 nerf pyro in TF2 General Discussion
TwiiKuuhint bc ur not getting it: it's not hard to have the moral/logical high ground when defending your position, regardless of what's being discussed, nothing will ever come out of it because admins are pussies, nobody actually cares, people have the right to express frustration


As for assuming the admins won't make drastically misinformed decisions, I used to think like you.

But they banned the Dragon's Fury, which makes 0 sense, and I honestly believe they are going after the Detonator next.

So no, I am not going to allow people to spread misinformation and rabble rouse, because I think it does have real consequences. I also don't want lurkers to come upon this thread and perpetuate inaccurate criticism of the game.

If you admit that you are on the moral / logical low ground, you can't just stay there because it's comfortable, because changing hurts, because it means you were wrong. You should seek the moral and logical high ground in all things even if it hurts, because it leads you to being better for it. Don't become so attached to what you believe that you're not willing to shift your beliefs upon realizing that they make no sense. That leads to personal stagnation and prevents you from reaching your potential.

posted about 2 years ago
#204 nerf pyro in TF2 General Discussion
Cyanicwhy are we still arguing with 4812622 when it's clear he either has never played competitive tf2 at any reasonable level or he has 20IQ and doesn't understand how it should take skill to frag someone.

I don't understand why pubbers and Steel players are trying to play the "you don't have enough competitive experience" card on me.

Hunter_2_0Why are you so desperate to defend pyro?

He adds nothing to the game.
He's not skillful or fun to play with/against.

Pyro's existence can only make competitive tf2 worse.

This shit is as ridiculous as the hysteria back in HRG days when people were blaming the slow metagame on Heavy and Engineer and calling for class limit 0. Offclasses are not uncounterable or broken, they are good for the game. Turtle classes help ensure the dynamism of 6s is preserved by mitigating the heavily unfavorable situation of being stuck on last with Uber disadvantage after wiping on mid. 5CP is good because both teams at any moment have so many options, have to make so many decisions. Pyro is a huge part of being able to defend against a full Uber push into last and the ability to clutch a round from the jaws of defeat makes the game exciting and fun both to watch and to play.

It's not as cut and dry as saying that Pyro slows down the game, either. Certain stalemates that are incredibly difficult to break, like Viaduct forward hold, pushing Granary second, and pushing Gullywash / Blands last, can be broken by running Pyro. This speeds up and freshens the metagame. What's more, the inability of Pyro to effectively hold chokes because of bad range provides opportunities for smart teams to push whereas they wouldn't feel comfortable doing so against a Scout or Soldier, because they are better.

And out of these niche situations, Pyro is still really fucking bad. It is significantly harder to play Pyro full time and win at a high level than Scout and Soldier, which is probably why nobody has done it. Outside of holding last, running Pyro means you're giving up consistency, flexibility, and raw power, which is a huge risk and easily punishable. If you read your opponents tendencies to make mistakes and take the risk of going Pyro instead of staying on the consistently good and almost always better standard classes, and it actually pays off, then that is skill.

Restricting classes alienates your playerbase. Back when I was a pubber, over half my friends who were interested in competitive TF2 were turned off of 6s by a perceived state of staleness and inflexibility and ended up losing interest because pubs and Highlander are boring. My first 6s team had two Pyro mains, a Heavy main, and a Sniper main, but we realized that those classes were inflexible and bad and became fully-fledged 6s players. These are the people who you are turning away from 6s by banning Pyro, and you'll never realize how hard you fucked the playercount because nobody will be here to tell you about it.

Last and least, I personally find reaction reflecting (predicting when they shoot because they're too close to react) to be one of the most challenging and satisfying things in TF2. There are so many things about Pyro, like reflect jumping, or finding new detjump flanks and hiding spots, or maximizing damage per particle, or the Dragon's Fury / Jetpack, that make it so even the best Pyros haven't approached the skill ceiling. I enjoy outplaying people by doing suboptimal, unorthodox things, and I enjoy specifically fighting Pyros as projectile classes because of the psychological intensity that reflecting brings to the matchup.

I understand that there many 6s players who don't share my opinions. Disagreeing with me is fine, but what frustrates me is when people disagree with me and dislike Pyro because they either don't understand or refuse to attempt to understand. There are people in this thread who are arguing that the only counters to Pyro are Sniper and other Pyros, that they win every other matchup. There are people who are arguing the Dragon's Fury is too strong. These things aren't just differences in opinion, they are flat out, factually wrong. So, so, laughably, utterly wrong.

I want to ensure that the hysteria in this thread doesn't spill out of control, and lead to the whitelist getting fucked because ignorant people are consumed with fear of things that they do not understand.

So if anyone wants to actually discuss anything, instead of restating their opinions, flat out telling me I don't know what I'm talking about without a tenth of my experience or any evidence, and posting gifs of confused people, let's do it.

posted about 2 years ago
#196 nerf pyro in TF2 General Discussion
Apt*pyro phlogs and ubers onto last point from underneath*

*literally forced to run at it or they lose because when the uber ends its gonna start a 2x cap*

"wtf why didnt you hold s thats how pyro is countered"


I already responded to this, but I'll do it again.

Let's think this through.

No, you do not press S when you have a better Uber, because Uber makes you immune to flames, and flames are why you are pressing S.

The mistake was the Medic dropping the chasing defending Pyro, which not only killed the defending Pyro, let the Medic and Phlog Pyro live when they should have died (the Degreaser Pyro can lock the Phlog Pyro into the corner so there was no chance of the Phlog Pyro escaping), but it gave up Phlog charge, which culminated into pressuring the defenders into dropping onto point and abandoning high ground and distance.

Was the Phlog counterable? Yes.

Did the defending team fuck up? Yes.

Did they deserve to lose because they fucked up? Yes.

People need to start blaming themselves for making stupid plays instead of finding some scapegoat to salvage their pride. I guarantee if anyone in this thread watched a demo of every time they died to a Pyro, they would immediately realize that either Soldier / Scout could have done the same thing better, or that they could easily avoided dying had someone (including themselves) not fucked up, or both.

posted about 2 years ago
#191 nerf pyro in TF2 General Discussion

LMAO did you just look up "fallacy" on wikipedia and expect it to completely shut down the conversation?

What is my misrepresentation of your argument?

And I have no idea where you're going with the fallacy fallacy attack. I never once claimed that people were wrong because they made bad arguments. I claimed things (Pyro is not overpowered, Dragon's Fury is not overpowered, Detonator is not overpowered), backed them with reasoning (limited range and speed and bad matchups vs almost every class, inferior to and more difficult than stock, a scapegoat for actually pressing issues), and countered people's arguments against me, which involves pointing out fallacies.

Nowhere did I say that "because your committed a logical error, I am right." Rather, the logical error means that your criticism of my argument is invalid, and you have to either make a new argument, or cede the point.

I can list logical fallacies too. This is directed at everyone in the thread, not you in particular.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_the_stone - dismissing a statement as absurd without giving proof of its absurdity

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_ridicule - an informal fallacy which presents an opponent's argument as absurd, ridiculous, or humorous, and therefore not worth consideration

The examples of this are myriad. Jon_ saying "Yikes." viper / pov's gifs of confused people. Jon_ sarcastically admitting I'm right.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hasty_generalization - an informal fallacy of faulty generalization by reaching an inductive generalization based on insufficient evidence

This is showing that video of prem players getting rolled over by Phlog and using that as conclusive proof.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_populum - a proposition must be true because many or most people believe it

That's you.

posted about 2 years ago
#187 nerf pyro in TF2 General Discussion
TwiiKuulets get this str8 because ur not understanding.
its not fun.
thats not objective but its a shared opinion of 90% of the community at this point.
even pubbers fucking hate it.
it just isn't fun to play and to play against anymore.
do you know what we do with unfun things?
we ban them, that's why we have a whitelist, that's why we have class limits, that's why we have a map pool, because the best way to play the game isn't the fun way to play the game.

Yeah, I definitely remember our community's ancient, sacred tradition of polling Steel players and consulting r/tf2 on whether we should ban stuff.

posted about 2 years ago
#6 powah: "I'm happy to see that the scene keeps in movement somehow" in News

woo go ninjax!!

posted about 2 years ago
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