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ETF2L Season 38 and Preseason Cup announced
posted in News
31
#31
Process/Gullywash Refresh
0 Frags +

would imo be very epic to see KOTH gone permanently. swap out product instead and please don't consider clearcut.

would imo be very epic to see KOTH gone permanently. swap out product instead and please don't consider clearcut.
32
#32
13 Frags +
det-if only I had 0.0000001 more seconds to react to a pipe maybe i wouldnt get hit by it we need to ban this weapon guys!!!1!

often times ur gonna get hit anyway it is just unfun to get hit significantly earlier than u otherwise would be (fractions of a second definitely matter in the combat in this game if u think otherwise ur mentally ugly)

edit: Also big agree on removal of gc point for a 3-2 loss on product. It was never disputed in the past that that scoreline was a complete loss, it may have been a close one but a 2-1 loss on a slow map of 5cp can be close, yet no GC point is distributed unless it happens to be that the first 30 minutes was 1-1.

As Doughy said, remove golden caps in general and just allow draws to be a result in the season.

[quote=det-]if only I had 0.0000001 more seconds to react to a pipe maybe i wouldnt get hit by it we need to ban this weapon guys!!!1![/quote]
often times ur gonna get hit anyway it is just unfun to get hit significantly earlier than u otherwise would be (fractions of a second definitely matter in the combat in this game if u think otherwise ur mentally ugly)

edit: Also big agree on removal of gc point for a 3-2 loss on product. It was never disputed in the past that that scoreline was a complete loss, it may have been a close one but a 2-1 loss on a slow map of 5cp can be close, yet no GC point is distributed unless it happens to be that the first 30 minutes was 1-1.

As Doughy said, remove golden caps in general and just allow draws to be a result in the season.
33
#33
Process/Gullywash Refresh
0 Frags +
Makdet-if only I had 0.0000001 more seconds to react to a pipe maybe i wouldnt get hit by it we need to ban this weapon guys!!!1!often times ur gonna get hit anyway it is just unfun to get hit significantly earlier than u otherwise would be (fractions of a second definitely matter in the combat in this game if u think otherwise ur mentally ugly)

edit: Also big agree on removal of gc point for a 3-2 loss on product. It was never disputed in the past that that scoreline was a complete loss, it may have been a close one but a 2-1 loss on a slow map of 5cp can be close, yet no GC point is distributed unless it happens to be that the first 30 minutes was 1-1.

As Doughy said, remove golden caps in general and just allow draws to be a result in the season.

I don't think the width factor is irrelevant either, over the course of a map the effect it has on each pipe culminates to a noticable difference overall.

[quote=Mak][quote=det-]if only I had 0.0000001 more seconds to react to a pipe maybe i wouldnt get hit by it we need to ban this weapon guys!!!1![/quote]
often times ur gonna get hit anyway it is just unfun to get hit significantly earlier than u otherwise would be (fractions of a second definitely matter in the combat in this game if u think otherwise ur mentally ugly)

edit: Also big agree on removal of gc point for a 3-2 loss on product. It was never disputed in the past that that scoreline was a complete loss, it may have been a close one but a 2-1 loss on a slow map of 5cp can be close, yet no GC point is distributed unless it happens to be that the first 30 minutes was 1-1.

As Doughy said, remove golden caps in general and just allow draws to be a result in the season.[/quote]
I don't think the width factor is irrelevant either, over the course of a map the effect it has on each pipe culminates to a noticable difference overall.
34
#34
-7 Frags +
SilenteSYou have these 3 untested maps which may be good in their own right but no consideration of adding badlands back in? Weird.

Given clearcut is on it's 5th season in NA and is now being played in ozfortress and AsiaFortress, and villa is being played for a 3rd season in NA untested is a bit of a stretch.

[quote=SilenteS]You have these 3 untested maps which may be good in their own right but no consideration of adding badlands back in? Weird.[/quote]

Given clearcut is on it's 5th season in NA and is now being played in ozfortress and AsiaFortress, and villa is being played for a 3rd season in NA untested is a bit of a stretch.
35
#35
-6 Frags +

The reason we are reconsidering Granary and Metalworks for the season is because out of all the maps they were rated the lowest in the post-s37 polls which were conducted among the top tiers.

We are working on publishing the responses gathered from the survey and hopefully will be done after this weekend.

The reason we are reconsidering Granary and Metalworks for the season is because out of all the maps they were rated the lowest in the post-s37 polls which were conducted among the top tiers.

We are working on publishing the responses gathered from the survey and hopefully will be done after this weekend.
36
#36
26 Frags +

Pretty sure last seasons map pool was one of the best we have had for a long time. Not sure what the obsession is with changing maps every season. Even if gran and metal are rated low on the polls, theyre for sure better than clearcut reckoner and villa.

Also, any badlands in the new cup? That map is way better than anyone makes it out to be.

edit: why would we remove product, its the most fast paced gamemode (no stalemates, u dont just stare at walls for 30 min) and has been a around for years with no problems. Its also super fun to watch.

Pretty sure last seasons map pool was one of the best we have had for a long time. Not sure what the obsession is with changing maps every season. Even if gran and metal are rated low on the polls, theyre for sure better than clearcut reckoner and villa.

Also, any badlands in the new cup? That map is way better than anyone makes it out to be.

edit: why would we remove product, its the most fast paced gamemode (no stalemates, u dont just stare at walls for 30 min) and has been a around for years with no problems. Its also super fun to watch.
37
#37
Process/Gullywash Refresh
-21 Frags +
papiedit: why would we remove product, its the most fast paced gamemode (no stalemates, u dont just stare at walls for 30 min) and has been a around for years with no problems. Its also super fun to watch.

product has a bunch of problems, along with being too easy and effective to forward hold and like all other koth maps it has very troublesome sniper angles. the map layout i don't think is good either and honestly clearcut is probably better in that regard. i don't know why we're so eager to keep a map simply because "we need variation" or "it's fast paced" as if that's inherently good. also, if you look outside of prem, games on product often devolve into offclassing nightmares, mindless dmfights and other clown fiestas.

if we want to promote variation we should instead keep maps like granary and badlands, and if we want more fast paced action we should explore alternate gamemodes in which the shot clock is not 10 minutes long.

[quote=papi]
edit: why would we remove product, its the most fast paced gamemode (no stalemates, u dont just stare at walls for 30 min) and has been a around for years with no problems. Its also super fun to watch.[/quote]
product has a bunch of problems, along with being too easy and effective to forward hold and like all other koth maps it has very troublesome sniper angles. the map layout i don't think is good either and honestly clearcut is probably better in that regard. i don't know why we're so eager to keep a map simply because "we need variation" or "it's fast paced" as if that's inherently good. also, if you look outside of prem, games on product often devolve into offclassing nightmares, mindless dmfights and other clown fiestas.

if we want to promote variation we should instead keep maps like granary and badlands, and if we want more fast paced action we should explore alternate gamemodes in which the shot clock is not 10 minutes long.
38
#38
3 Frags +
MakPheaaImagine thinking that 4 fucking hammer units of size is what is making pipes hit you more often, the scout class moves 4 hammer units in literally 0.01 seconds
The horizontal axis isn't what matters it's the fact that an iron bomber pipe literally hits you before a stock pipe would (even if both are aimed straight at the guy and both are "fair" hits). It extends towards the player too and that's what makes it unfun and unfair to get hit by.

Pipes move at 1216 hammer units per second and iron bomber pipes extend 2 hammer units in front of stock. This means that iron bomber pipes hit 0.0016 seconds before stock. Which is an order of magnitude LESS impactful than the horizontal pipe size and I'm not even sure if the games tick system would even know the difference much less the person being hit.

What I'm saying is that the hitbox size is negligible compared to the impact of the size of the actual model being smaller. The iron bomber pipe model is roughly half the size of the stock pipes but stock pipes do fluctuate in size by spinning. Lets say the normal pipes are on average 1.5 times the size of iron bomber pipes. This means that if you see a stock pipe in the air you have 1.5 times the amount of time to dodge as you would with an iron bomber pipe. This translates to tenths of seconds less time to dodge as opposed to the hundredths and thousandths of seconds less caused by the hitbox.

[quote=Mak][quote=Pheaa]Imagine thinking that 4 fucking hammer units of size is what is making pipes hit you more often, the scout class moves 4 hammer units in literally 0.01 seconds[/quote]

The horizontal axis isn't what matters it's the fact that an iron bomber pipe literally hits you before a stock pipe would (even if both are aimed straight at the guy and both are "fair" hits). It extends towards the player too and that's what makes it unfun and unfair to get hit by.[/quote]

Pipes move at 1216 hammer units per second and iron bomber pipes extend 2 hammer units in front of stock. This means that iron bomber pipes hit 0.0016 seconds before stock. Which is an order of magnitude LESS impactful than the horizontal pipe size and I'm not even sure if the games tick system would even know the difference much less the person being hit.

What I'm saying is that the hitbox size is negligible compared to the impact of the size of the actual model being smaller. The iron bomber pipe model is roughly half the size of the stock pipes but stock pipes do fluctuate in size by spinning. Lets say the normal pipes are on average 1.5 times the size of iron bomber pipes. This means that if you see a stock pipe in the air you have 1.5 times the amount of time to dodge as you would with an iron bomber pipe. This translates to tenths of seconds less time to dodge as opposed to the hundredths and thousandths of seconds less caused by the hitbox.
39
#39
20 Frags +

"the map layout i don't think is good either and honestly clearcut is probably better in that regard"

LMFAO that is a fat krappa

also the best teams at via do not snipe, it is not good.

"the map layout i don't think is good either and honestly clearcut is probably better in that regard"

LMFAO that is a fat krappa

also the best teams at via do not snipe, it is not good.
40
#40
15 Frags +

i got one trust papi
, prem veteran since 2016 over collaide

i got one trust papi
, prem veteran since 2016 over collaide
41
#41
3 Frags +
Pheaa
Pipes move at 1216 hammer units per second and iron bomber pipes extend 2 hammer units in front of stock. This means that iron bomber pipes hit 0.0016 seconds before stock. Which is an order of magnitude LESS impactful than the horizontal pipe size and I'm not even sure if the games tick system would even know the difference much less the person being hit.

The grenade hitbox is always aligned to the map grid (like player collision), so if you are aiming diagonally relative to the map grid the hitbox will hit quicker than if you are aiming straight on.

[quote=Pheaa]

Pipes move at 1216 hammer units per second and iron bomber pipes extend 2 hammer units in front of stock. This means that iron bomber pipes hit 0.0016 seconds before stock. Which is an order of magnitude LESS impactful than the horizontal pipe size and I'm not even sure if the games tick system would even know the difference much less the person being hit.

[/quote]
The grenade hitbox is always aligned to the map grid (like player collision), so if you are aiming diagonally relative to the map grid the hitbox will hit quicker than if you are aiming straight on.
42
#42
5 Frags +
Pheaa-

I still think the fact that you can see the pipe explode infront of u if it's a headshot pipe is goofy as fuck and part of what makes it unfun to play against. IDK i love using it cause it's free but it rly isn't fun to play against, especially as Scout (could be just cause i suck nuts at scout tho). it's literally just unintuitive to play vs compared to stock pipes and the upside is that it "stops demo from becoming an irrelevant class" according to some people??? dont get me wrong, if it were fixed i wouldn't argue against it's mostly better rollers being something worth banning it over but as it is it should not be allowed lol

[quote=Pheaa]
-
[/quote]

I still think the fact that you can see the pipe explode infront of u if it's a headshot pipe is goofy as fuck and part of what makes it unfun to play against. IDK i love using it cause it's free but it rly isn't fun to play against, especially as Scout (could be just cause i suck nuts at scout tho). it's literally just unintuitive to play vs compared to stock pipes and the upside is that it "stops demo from becoming an irrelevant class" according to some people??? dont get me wrong, if it were fixed i wouldn't argue against it's mostly better rollers being something worth banning it over but as it is it should not be allowed lol
43
#43
Process/Gullywash Refresh
-4 Frags +
papialso the best teams at via do not snipe, it is not good.

should we adjust the map pool and balance maps for the benefit of the top 3 prem teams only? also dumb sniper angles doesn't mean they're overpowered vs perfect play lol

[quote=papi]also the best teams at via do not snipe, it is not good.[/quote]
should we adjust the map pool and balance maps for the benefit of the top 3 prem teams only? also dumb sniper angles doesn't mean they're overpowered vs perfect play lol
44
#44
7 Frags +
Collaideshould we adjust the map pool and balance maps for the benefit of the top 3 prem teams only?

Yes.

[quote=Collaide]should we adjust the map pool and balance maps for the benefit of the top 3 prem teams only?[/quote]Yes.
45
#45
Process/Gullywash Refresh
-6 Frags +
klassyCollaideshould we adjust the map pool and balance maps for the benefit of the top 3 prem teams only?Yes.

then we disagree

[quote=klassy][quote=Collaide]should we adjust the map pool and balance maps for the benefit of the top 3 prem teams only?[/quote]Yes.[/quote]
then we disagree
46
#46
11 Frags +
Collaidepapialso the best teams at via do not snipe, it is not good.should we adjust the map pool and balance maps for the benefit of the top 3 prem teams only? also dumb sniper angles doesn't mean they're overpowered vs perfect play lol

You don't balance anything around mid/high level play, that's just a bad idea for anything. You balance it for the top where people actually understand how to beat bad playstyles.

and this is coming from the guy who ran perma sniper with the best sniper to ever grace 6s (credu) and didn't find great success

[quote=Collaide][quote=papi]also the best teams at via do not snipe, it is not good.[/quote]
should we adjust the map pool and balance maps for the benefit of the top 3 prem teams only? also dumb sniper angles doesn't mean they're overpowered vs perfect play lol[/quote]

You don't balance anything around mid/high level play, that's just a bad idea for anything. You balance it for the top where people actually understand how to beat bad playstyles.

and this is coming from the guy who ran perma sniper with the best sniper to ever grace 6s (credu) and didn't find great success
47
#47
9 Frags +

I'm just gona say if ironbomber wasn't way better than the stock all these demo mains wouldn't care if it was removed. Instead I see them argue how it isn't that much better every time the debate comes up. You can tell who they are because the good demo mains aren't arguing for it but against it.

I'm just gona say if ironbomber wasn't way better than the stock all these demo mains wouldn't care if it was removed. Instead I see them argue how it isn't that much better every time the debate comes up. You can tell who they are because the good demo mains aren't arguing for it but against it.
48
#48
Process/Gullywash Refresh
-5 Frags +
DomoCatFaceYou don't balance anything around mid/high level play, that's just a bad idea for anything. You balance it for the top where people actually understand how to beat bad playstyles.

and this is coming from the guy who ran perma sniper with the best sniper to ever grace 6s (credu) and didn't find great success

i mostly agree with balancing around top level play, but occationally there are behaviours in low-level play that make the game unfair and unfun for people at that level. that shouldn't instantly be dismissed just because higher level players can deal with it.

with that said i still think 5cp is a better gamemode, and i believe there are more suitable maps that are good across all levels.

[quote=DomoCatFace]You don't balance anything around mid/high level play, that's just a bad idea for anything. You balance it for the top where people actually understand how to beat bad playstyles.

and this is coming from the guy who ran perma sniper with the best sniper to ever grace 6s (credu) and didn't find great success[/quote]
i mostly agree with balancing around top level play, but occationally there are behaviours in low-level play that make the game unfair and unfun for people at that level. that shouldn't instantly be dismissed just because higher level players can deal with it.

with that said i still think 5cp is a better gamemode, and i believe there are more suitable maps that are good across all levels.
49
#49
18 Frags +

I wanna remove KOTH too but not because of any deep reasons or anything I just have bad DM

I wanna remove KOTH too but not because of any deep reasons or anything I just have bad DM
50
#50
10 Frags +
Collaidewould imo be very epic to see KOTH gone permanently. swap out product instead and please don't consider clearcut.

I think koth maps are the most fun to play/watch in 6s i dont know why would you ever wanna remove that, about the map pool i think clearcut should be put in because first of all koth is very fun and because right now if a team doesnt like koth they just ban it and the gamemode is completely out of the game

[quote=Collaide]would imo be very epic to see KOTH gone permanently. swap out product instead and please don't consider clearcut.[/quote] I think koth maps are the most fun to play/watch in 6s i dont know why would you ever wanna remove that, about the map pool i think clearcut should be put in because first of all koth is very fun and because right now if a team doesnt like koth they just ban it and the gamemode is completely out of the game
51
#51
2 Frags +
DomoCatFacethe best sniper to ever grace 6s (credu) and didn't find great success

Flippy being done dirty here.

Also I did only play Clearcut a couple times, in one of the cups last year, but I had a pretty good time on it. I wouldn't mind seeing it in the season even if only for one week, which I think was done for maps a couple seasons ago.

[quote=DomoCatFace]
the best sniper to ever grace 6s (credu) and didn't find great success[/quote]

Flippy being done dirty here.

Also I did only play Clearcut a couple times, in one of the cups last year, but I had a pretty good time on it. I wouldn't mind seeing it in the season even if only for one week, which I think was done for maps a couple seasons ago.
52
#52
-2 Frags +

koth is the best to play for me and i think most people woudl say most entertaining on stream too. we should have more of it ideally. koth always was the most fun shit to watch during hte iseries lans

koth is the best to play for me and i think most people woudl say most entertaining on stream too. we should have more of it ideally. koth always was the most fun shit to watch during hte iseries lans
53
#53
0 Frags +

Looking forward for some EU action on Villa. Played it in OZF S29 and loved it. Shame its not here for S30. Clearcut is also a load of fun, I enjoy it more than Viaduct.

Looking forward for some EU action on Villa. Played it in OZF S29 and loved it. Shame its not here for S30. Clearcut is also a load of fun, I enjoy it more than Viaduct.
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