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Essentials.TF Labs: 133 Tickrate training servers
1
#1
0 Frags +

Hello,

As we're running tests in our laboratories, we sometimes need test subjects. We need server performance reports from the sweatiest of gamers. These tests will run for a few days. Give us feedback about everything.

Client cvars updaterate and cmdrate are forced to 133, rate is forced between 40kbps and 240kbps
Recommended settings:

cl_interp 0.0001
cl_interp_ratio 1

Unlocked Tickrate: https://github.com/ldesgoui/mms-unlocked-tickrate
Sticky Delay Fix: https://github.com/ldesgoui/tf2-sticky-delay-fix
MGE: https://github.com/Lange/MGEMod
SOAP: https://github.com/Lange/SOAP-TF2DM

We're done hosting for now, thanks for trying it out! Here's a few servers hosted by friends!

MGE ChillyPunch in Europe, provided by Kuferl.tf:
connect dm.kuferl.tf:27030
SOAP in Europe, provided by Kuferl.tf:
connect dm.kuferl.tf:27016
MGE in Singapore, provided by PepperKick:
connect 209.58.177.29
MGE ChillyPunch in Singapore, provided by PepperKick:
connect 209.58.177.29:27030

  • Movement and melee feels more responsive
  • Projectiles jitter less
  • Bhops can be chained to more than 3 (gemm got 10?)
  • Pipes are bouncier
  • Bugs that require tick-perfect timing are now "twice as hard" to pull off because ticks are shorter. (Speedshots, maybe rampslides?)
  • Wall Bugs happen more often.
  • Wrangled sentries seem to do twice as much damage (except level 1)
  • Shutter doors are not affected

Thanks

Hello,

As we're running tests in our laboratories, we sometimes need test subjects. We need server performance reports from the sweatiest of gamers. These tests will run for a few days. [b]Give us feedback about everything[/b].

Client cvars updaterate and cmdrate are forced to 133, rate is forced between 40kbps and 240kbps
Recommended settings:
[code]
cl_interp 0.0001
cl_interp_ratio 1
[/code]

Unlocked Tickrate: https://github.com/ldesgoui/mms-unlocked-tickrate
Sticky Delay Fix: https://github.com/ldesgoui/tf2-sticky-delay-fix
MGE: https://github.com/Lange/MGEMod
SOAP: https://github.com/Lange/SOAP-TF2DM

[b]We're done hosting for now, thanks for trying it out! Here's a few servers hosted by friends![/b]

MGE ChillyPunch in Europe, provided by Kuferl.tf:
[url=steam://connect/dm.kuferl.tf:27030]connect dm.kuferl.tf:27030[/url]
SOAP in Europe, provided by Kuferl.tf:
[url=steam://connect/dm.kuferl.tf:27016]connect dm.kuferl.tf:27016[/url]
MGE in Singapore, provided by PepperKick:
[url=steam://connect/209.58.177.29]connect 209.58.177.29[/url]
MGE ChillyPunch in Singapore, provided by PepperKick:
[url=steam://connect/209.58.177.29:27030]connect 209.58.177.29:27030[/url]


[list]
[*] Movement and melee feels more responsive
[*] Projectiles jitter less
[*] Bhops can be chained to more than 3 (gemm got 10?)
[*] Pipes are bouncier
[*] Bugs that require tick-perfect timing are now "twice as hard" to pull off because ticks are shorter. (Speedshots, maybe rampslides?)
[*] Wall Bugs happen more often.
[*] Wrangled sentries seem to do twice as much damage (except level 1)
[*] Shutter doors are not affected
[/list]

Thanks
2
#2
23 Frags +

network settings to use higher tickrate imo:
rate 133000
cl_interp 0.0001
cl_updaterate 133
cl_cmdrate 133
cl_interp_ratio 1

network settings to use higher tickrate imo:
rate 133000
cl_interp 0.0001
cl_updaterate 133
cl_cmdrate 133
cl_interp_ratio 1
3
#3
18 Frags +

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1061/1924/products/Eyes_Emoji_large.png?v=1480481045

[img]https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1061/1924/products/Eyes_Emoji_large.png?v=1480481045[/img]
4
#4
Stream Highlights
2 Frags +

Just a question: What does any of this mean?
I would be perfectly willing to help out, if I knew what I was supposed to do.

Just a question: What does any of this mean?
I would be perfectly willing to help out, if I knew what I was supposed to do.
5
#5
8 Frags +
TailorTFJust a question: What does any of this mean?
I would be perfectly willing to help out, if I knew what I was supposed to do.

tf2 is normally 66 tick

these servers are 133 tick and are an experiment to see how stable they are/how they affect gameplay

they might disappear after a bit but if ppl like them they'll stay

give feedback

[quote=TailorTF]Just a question: What does any of this mean?
I would be perfectly willing to help out, if I knew what I was supposed to do.[/quote]

tf2 is normally 66 tick

these servers are 133 tick and are an experiment to see how stable they are/how they affect gameplay

they might disappear after a bit but if ppl like them they'll stay

give feedback
6
#6
7 Frags +
TwiiKuuSidney, Australia

i think u mean Sydney

[quote=TwiiKuu]Sidney, Australia[/quote]
i think u mean Sydney
7
#7
8 Frags +
VouriTwiiKuuSidney, Australiai think u mean Sydney

HiipFire - Today at 7:37 PM
uhh @twiikuu it's spelled sydney
twiikuu - Today at 7:38 PM
YAWN

[quote=Vouri][quote=TwiiKuu]Sidney, Australia[/quote]
i think u mean Sydney[/quote]
HiipFire - Today at 7:37 PM
uhh @twiikuu it's spelled sydney
twiikuu - Today at 7:38 PM
YAWN
8
#8
2 Frags +

I tried it out with funs, didn't really notice much difference besides it felt easier to hit as soldier. Felt like rockets were travelling faster

I tried it out with funs, didn't really notice much difference besides it felt easier to hit as soldier. Felt like rockets were travelling faster
9
#9
10 Frags +

tickrate changes fucked with sentries in the past, making them way stronger iirc? Is there a way to check if this still happens?

tickrate changes fucked with sentries in the past, making them way stronger iirc? Is there a way to check if this still happens?
10
#10
1 Frags +

just played some mge and it seems smoother and a lot nicer to strafe though not a huge difference overall; I am on 60hz though idk if that makes a difference.

just played some mge and it seems smoother and a lot nicer to strafe though not a huge difference overall; I am on 60hz though idk if that makes a difference.
11
#11
1 Frags +

Also at 60hz and it does make it smoother and nicer to strafe.

I have 5 ping to the server though, that could also affect things

Also at 60hz and it does make it smoother and nicer to strafe.

I have 5 ping to the server though, that could also affect things
12
#12
3 Frags +

at 144hz the sentry tracking/idle animations are very choppy, even with interp on. that's the only oddity i noticed from messing around on the NA DM server by myself for a bit. general movement, airstrafing, rocket jumping etc. all feel extremely smooth and responsive, even with 60 ping. would absolutely love to try playing some pugs with these plugins.

Zestytickrate changes fucked with sentries in the past, making them way stronger iirc? Is there a way to check if this still happens?

the DM servers don't seem to have any kind of whitelist or class-specific limits (max 2 of everything) so you could always just hop on with other people and build some sentries i guess

at 144hz the sentry tracking/idle animations are very choppy, even with interp on. that's the only oddity i noticed from messing around on the NA DM server by myself for a bit. general movement, airstrafing, rocket jumping etc. all feel extremely smooth and responsive, even with 60 ping. would absolutely love to try playing some pugs with these plugins.

[quote=Zesty]tickrate changes fucked with sentries in the past, making them way stronger iirc? Is there a way to check if this still happens?[/quote]

the DM servers don't seem to have any kind of whitelist or class-specific limits (max 2 of everything) so you could always just hop on with other people and build some sentries i guess
13
#13
6 Frags +

I have 7.6 interp and the game feels smoother than ever for me. Everything is super crisp on 240hz. I dont think it is placebo. Make sure you guys use the net settings on comment #2.

I have 7.6 interp and the game feels smoother than ever for me. Everything is super crisp on 240hz. I dont think it is placebo. Make sure you guys use the net settings on comment #2.
14
#14
cp_granary_pro
14 Frags +

this needs to be standard asap

this needs to be standard asap
15
#15
8 Frags +

my 100 ping felt like 35 and that made me very happy

my 100 ping felt like 35 and that made me very happy
16
#16
9 Frags +

I would recommend setting this on clients and on the server:

net_maxcleartime 0.001
net_compresspackets 0
net_maxroutable 1260

Though, net_maxcleartime will increase net usage some if you use it on the server, so if you aren't comfortable with doing that. Furthermore, I understand rate is capped at like 160k, but I would recommend it being 176624 at a bare minimum for 133 tick.

On the server:

net_splitrate 2

On clients:

cl_interp 0.0001
cl_updaterate 132
cl_cmdrate 132
cl_interp_ratio 1
net_splitrate 4
I would recommend setting this on clients and on the server:
[code]net_maxcleartime 0.001
net_compresspackets 0
net_maxroutable 1260[/code]

Though, net_maxcleartime will increase net usage some if you use it on the server, so if you aren't comfortable with doing that. Furthermore, I understand rate is capped at like 160k, but I would recommend it being 176624 at a bare minimum for 133 tick.

On the server:
[code]net_splitrate 2[/code]

On clients:
[code]cl_interp 0.0001
cl_updaterate 132
cl_cmdrate 132
cl_interp_ratio 1
net_splitrate 4[/code]
17
#17
15 Frags +

If I remember correctly in the past higher tickrate servers had issues with shutter doors and airstrafing(among other things). I played in the dm server and didn't notice either of these being a problem does this mean you fixed it or did I miss something?

Also please add classlimits/whitelist.

If I remember correctly in the past higher tickrate servers had issues with shutter doors and airstrafing(among other things). I played in the dm server and didn't notice either of these being a problem does this mean you fixed it or did I miss something?

Also please add classlimits/whitelist.
18
#18
TF2Pickup
17 Frags +

If people really want this and it works without any side-effects I don't mind adding this to my dm servers

If people really want this and it works without any side-effects I don't mind adding this to my dm servers
19
#19
1 Frags +
KuferlIf people really want this and it works without any side-effects I don't mind adding this to my dm servers

Would love this. Yes please.

[quote=Kuferl]If people really want this and it works without any side-effects I don't mind adding this to my dm servers[/quote]

Would love this. Yes please.
20
#20
1 Frags +

I'll update original post with what people have reported so far, and what we've discovered as well.

VouriTwiiKuuSidney, Australiai think u mean Sydney

Sorry!

cantiat 144hz the sentry tracking/idle animations are very choppy, even with interp on. that's the only oddity i noticed from messing around on the NA DM server by myself for a bit.

We couldn't reproduce that, could you give us more details or a video to showcase it?

mastercoms

I've added all of this but could you explain what they change? Thanks.

JojoAlso please add classlimits/whitelist.

We won't restrict anymore than what's already allowed (2 of each on SOAP, sc/sol/dem/sniper on MGE), we'd rather see people test every class and weapons.

KuferlIf people really want this and it works without any side-effects I don't mind adding this to my dm servers

I would actually rather see this happen than us hosting our own servers, hit me up if you need any help setting up.

I'll update original post with what people have reported so far, and what we've discovered as well.

[quote=Vouri][quote=TwiiKuu]Sidney, Australia[/quote]i think u mean Sydney[/quote]
Sorry!

[quote=canti]at 144hz the sentry tracking/idle animations are very choppy, even with interp on. that's the only oddity i noticed from messing around on the NA DM server by myself for a bit.[/quote]
We couldn't reproduce that, could you give us more details or a video to showcase it?

[quote=mastercoms][/quote]
I've added all of this but could you explain what they change? Thanks.

[quote=Jojo]Also please add classlimits/whitelist.[/quote]
We won't restrict anymore than what's already allowed (2 of each on SOAP, sc/sol/dem/sniper on MGE), we'd rather see people test every class and weapons.

[quote=Kuferl]If people really want this and it works without any side-effects I don't mind adding this to my dm servers[/quote]
I would actually rather see this happen than us hosting our own servers, hit me up if you need any help setting up.
21
#21
0 Frags +

When I tried this before bhopping felt more consistent (i.e. scrolling down every time you land will almost always keep your RJ going) which is kinda counterintuitive, can anyone reproduce?

Csgo works differently but with that it isn't really any harder on high tickrate, it just changes the timing a bit (because you need to send a +jump on one tick and a -jump on the next I THINK)

When I tried this before bhopping felt more consistent (i.e. scrolling down every time you land will almost always keep your RJ going) which is kinda counterintuitive, can anyone reproduce?

Csgo works differently but with that it isn't really any harder on high tickrate, it just changes the timing a bit (because you need to send a +jump on one tick and a -jump on the next I THINK)
22
#22
0 Frags +
TwiiKuu133 TickrateWolfMachina, mastercomscl_updaterate 132
cl_cmdrate 132

Why?

WolfMachina, mastercomscl_interp 0.0001

Why not just cl_interp 0? I don't see anything special about the value 0.0001, so it'll just clamp to 1/cl_updaterate either way.

mastercomsI would recommend setting this on clients and on the server:
net_compresspackets 0

This sounds like it will increase network usage, which will presumably already be pretty high seeing as the server is 133 tick. Can't speak for everyone but my internet isn't great so I'd prefer if this were avoided.

[quote=TwiiKuu]133 Tickrate[/quote]

[quote=WolfMachina, mastercoms]cl_updaterate 132
cl_cmdrate 132[/quote]

Why?

[quote=WolfMachina, mastercoms]cl_interp 0.0001[/quote]

Why not just cl_interp 0? I don't see anything special about the value 0.0001, so it'll just clamp to 1/cl_updaterate either way.

[quote=mastercoms]I would recommend setting this on clients and on the server:

[code]net_compresspackets 0[/code][/quote]

This sounds like it will increase network usage, which will presumably already be pretty high seeing as the server is 133 tick. Can't speak for everyone but my internet isn't great so I'd prefer if this were avoided.
23
#23
0 Frags +

The interp is because I've seen issues in the past with setting interp to 0 when on LAN, so this ensures you're always on the lowest and never run into problems :)

The interp is because I've seen issues in the past with setting interp to 0 when on LAN, so this ensures you're always on the lowest and never run into problems :)
24
#24
serveme.tf
14 Frags +

I've modified 3 EU serveme.tf servers to run at 133Hz:

133Hz - BolusBrigade #1
133Hz - BeretBrigade #1
133Hz - KroketBrigade #1

Just tick "Enable plugins" when making your reservation.

I've modified 3 EU [url=https://serveme.tf/]serveme.tf[/url] servers to run at 133Hz:

133Hz - BolusBrigade #1
133Hz - BeretBrigade #1
133Hz - KroketBrigade #1

Just tick "Enable plugins" when making your reservation.
25
#25
0 Frags +
FreudWhy?

I don't know, but that's the update/cmdrate they chose, so I decided not to mess with that.

FreudWhy not just cl_interp 0? I don't see anything special about the value 0.0001, so it'll just clamp to 1/cl_updaterate either way.

I prefer cl_interp 0, but since they recommended it and there isn't any difference (besides servers rules), I just put it again.

FreudThis sounds like it will increase network usage, which will presumably already be pretty high seeing as the server is 133 tick. Can't speak for everyone but my internet isn't great so I'd prefer if this were avoided.

Packet compression doesn't do much and with that many packets, there's going to be much more load from compression.

TwiiKuuI've added all of this but could you explain what they change? Thanks.

net_maxcleartime 0.001 - Reduces packet delay to a minimum, which will help tremendously with choke issues
net_splitrate 2 - Changes the rate at which packets are split into smaller chunks if they're too large
net_compresspackets 0 - Disables using more CPU to reduce packet size by a little bit, since they're so many packets being sent, this reduces load by a lot
net_maxroutable 1260 - Ensures packets aren't being split unless they're at the maximum allowable size in the engine

Oh yeah, and I forgot that you should also be scaling up your split packet rate as well (this is the rate at which split packets are sent): net_splitpacket_maxrate. Set that to the same value as your rate setting.

Also maybe you can use sv_parallel_sendsnapshot 1, but I'm sure not sure about the stability of that one. It basically threads sending packets to all players.

[quote=Freud]Why?[/quote]
I don't know, but that's the update/cmdrate they chose, so I decided not to mess with that.

[quote=Freud]Why not just cl_interp 0? I don't see anything special about the value 0.0001, so it'll just clamp to 1/cl_updaterate either way.[/quote]
I prefer cl_interp 0, but since they recommended it and there isn't any difference (besides servers rules), I just put it again.

[quote=Freud]This sounds like it will increase network usage, which will presumably already be pretty high seeing as the server is 133 tick. Can't speak for everyone but my internet isn't great so I'd prefer if this were avoided.[/quote]
Packet compression doesn't do much and with that many packets, there's going to be much more load from compression.

[quote=TwiiKuu]I've added all of this but could you explain what they change? Thanks.[/quote]
net_maxcleartime 0.001 - Reduces packet delay to a minimum, which will help tremendously with choke issues
net_splitrate 2 - Changes the rate at which packets are split into smaller chunks if they're too large
net_compresspackets 0 - Disables using more CPU to reduce packet size by a little bit, since they're so many packets being sent, this reduces load by a lot
net_maxroutable 1260 - Ensures packets aren't being split unless they're at the maximum allowable size in the engine

Oh yeah, and I forgot that you should also be scaling up your split packet rate as well (this is the rate at which split packets are sent): net_splitpacket_maxrate. Set that to the same value as your rate setting.

Also maybe you can use sv_parallel_sendsnapshot 1, but I'm sure not sure about the stability of that one. It basically threads sending packets to all players.
26
#26
0 Frags +

Could you made edit your post to include all the steps you need to do in order to play on these servers?
Like you've added a few settings but do I need to change the stuff WolfMachina posted as well (mastercoms also posted some different/extra things)?

Could you made edit your post to include all the steps you need to do in order to play on these servers?
Like you've added a few settings but do I need to change the stuff WolfMachina posted as well (mastercoms also posted some different/extra things)?
27
#27
serveme.tf
0 Frags +
mastercomsnet_compresspackets 0 - Disables using more CPU to reduce packet size by a little bit, since they're so many packets being sent, this reduces load by a lot

We're talking kilobytes per second here, this will not cause >1% CPU load on any CPU made since TF2 was released. Also, only large packets are compressed (net_compresspackets_minsize).

[quote=mastercoms]net_compresspackets 0 - Disables using more CPU to reduce packet size by a little bit, since they're so many packets being sent, this reduces load by a lot
[/quote]

We're talking kilobytes per second here, this will not cause >1% CPU load on any CPU made since TF2 was released. Also, only large packets are compressed (net_compresspackets_minsize).
28
#28
0 Frags +
ArieWe're talking kilobytes per second here, this will not cause >1% CPU load on any CPU made since TF2 was released. Also, only large packets are compressed (net_compresspackets_minsize).

But there's no point for that extra load/delay on packets being compressed. The server and client both have to do extra processing for compression, and for little benefit. With such high rates being used anyway for this server, I don't think compression even has any sort of case to be used.

[quote=Arie]We're talking kilobytes per second here, this will not cause >1% CPU load on any CPU made since TF2 was released. Also, only large packets are compressed (net_compresspackets_minsize).[/quote]
But there's no point for that extra load/delay on packets being compressed. The server and client both have to do extra processing for compression, and for little benefit. With such high rates being used anyway for this server, I don't think compression even has any sort of case to be used.
29
#29
-1 Frags +
mastercomsWith such high rates being used anyway for this server, I don't think compression even has any sort of case to be used.

I'm not sure what your logic is here. If compression reduces the average packet size to X% of what it was originally, only X% of the original bandwidth will be used. This saving will apply regardless of the rate packets are being sent at.

mastercomsFreudmastercomsOn clients:
cl_updaterate 132
cl_cmdrate 132

Why?

I don't know, but that's the update/cmdrate they chose
TwiiKuuClient cvars updaterate and cmdrate are forced to 133

???

Edit:

mastercomsI don't know, but that's the update/cmdrate they chose, so I decided not to mess with that.mastercomsI prefer cl_interp 0, but since they recommended it and there isn't any difference (besides servers rules), I just put it again.

Can't think of a good way of phrasing this, but I don't think you should be giving out advice based on justification this weak.

[quote=mastercoms]With such high rates being used anyway for this server, I don't think compression even has any sort of case to be used.[/quote]

I'm not sure what your logic is here. If compression reduces the average packet size to X% of what it was originally, only X% of the original bandwidth will be used. This saving will apply regardless of the rate packets are being sent at.

[quote=mastercoms][quote=Freud][quote=mastercoms]On clients:
[code]cl_updaterate 132
cl_cmdrate 132[/code][/quote]

Why?[/quote]

I don't know, but that's the update/cmdrate they chose[/quote]

[quote=TwiiKuu]Client cvars updaterate and cmdrate are forced to 133[/quote]

???

Edit:

[quote=mastercoms]I don't know, but that's the update/cmdrate they chose, so I decided not to mess with that.[/quote]

[quote=mastercoms]I prefer cl_interp 0, but since they recommended it and there isn't any difference (besides servers rules), I just put it again.[/quote]

Can't think of a good way of phrasing this, but I don't think you should be giving out advice based on justification this weak.
30
#30
serveme.tf
1 Frags +
mastercomsBut there's no point for that extra load/delay on packets being compressed.

The point is reduced transmission times and fitting all packets within sv_maxrate, it's a trade-off. The time you lose (<0.02ms) to compress a packet is gained by having to spend less time transmitting it (because it's now smaller).

I'd stick with the defaults (both client and server) over lists of TF2 client and server cvars with no data/benchmarks.

[quote=mastercoms]But there's no point for that extra load/delay on packets being compressed.[/quote]
The point is reduced transmission times and fitting all packets within sv_maxrate, it's a trade-off. The time you lose (<0.02ms) to compress a packet is gained by having to spend less time transmitting it (because it's now smaller).

I'd stick with the defaults (both client and server) over lists of TF2 client and server cvars with no data/benchmarks.
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