not
an
argument

every news site is partisan the ones who hide it are the worrying ones

Which the intercept and the other left wing news sources I tend to cite (jacobin, secular talk, current affairs, FAIR, etc.) definitely don't

For example, the following article obviously has a point of view:
http://fair.org/home/arms-deal-stories-omit-war-crimes-arms-will-be-used-for/

But that doesn't mean it's not filled with useful, factual information

I'm surely not the only person here who has never heard of a single one of those websites

you're probably right, but why does it matter

whats their position on samsquanches

Couldn't believe it when I woke up this morning, you don't ever think it could happen so close to you or anyone you know.
Thoughts are with those who have lost any family or people they know.

I actually thought about you and Tom when I heard about the news my friend, glad you're okay

All my friends and family are fine thanks Ombrack, but there was another bomb found inside of the Arndale centre about 15 minutes ago where my family work, they are being evacuated and the centre is being closed.
Just scary what some people are capable of.

Deus Volt Crusade Bros 2017 Fuck The Terrorists Scum

https://puu.sh/vZaHV/c99d419c9d.jpg

-

You don't need to repeatedly mention that people aren't referring to Islam or Muslims as a whole when they point to group solidarity over extremist scripture as the primary driving force for terrorism in this case, or even that not every Muslim is a part of the caliphate. Otherwise intelligent people will kill others in the name of widely held, echo chambered beliefs and ideas existing in the mainstream version of Islamic scripture.

As a matter of importance it usually is just that simple and it's completely laughable that anybody would attempt to imply otherwise for every single terrorist attack, the excuse is always inherently handy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0s70gbdf4AY

thank god reviewbrah is ok

leave it to mustardovercuck to come to the defense of islam. children were killed ffs. how many more people need to fucking die before you pull your heads out of your asses?

.

Deus Vult. Lrn 2 crusade u casual.

I wasn't aware that I was repeating myself in this context, but maybe I am? I generally respond in such ways to ignorant statements and perhaps they've come up a lot.

*Any* excuse will do - Islam is just the most popular one right now because most others don't offer the sorts of benefits that they used to. So where does that leave us? The reason I repeat myself is because in order to actually make any sort of impact - in so far as preventing these sorts of tragedies from occurring both in Europe and abroad, a rather nuanced approach is going to have to be adopted both by governing institutions *and* individuals themselves who have any sort of regular interaction with Muslims generally (I happen to have a lot).

Politicians will come out and say "oh you're in our hearts" and then proceed to do nothing - or actively make the situation worse by funding radical groups. Barbarians will call for the liquidation of all Muslims, which will only make radical Islamists more convinced that they are indeed in mortal danger - but typically both reactions are just ways of doing nothing that feel slightly better than doing absolutely nothing.

I also have no idea who you are Goaskalice but you *sure* do presume to know a lot about me.

I am not pro-Hamas - will I point out that they *legally* do have a right to utilize armed force against occupation? Yes - because all people do and that is how international law works. Would I like to see a Palestinian state that was run by Hamas? Absolutely not. The problem with Palestinian society is that the PLO is woefully inept and corrupt, and Hamas managed to fill the space that their ineptitude left - in part because other groups' constituencies were bled dry by emigration (socialists, mainstream-ish liberals, Western Conservative types, etc). Hamas also benefits from sentiments that are *very* much held in common with anti-Islamic types in that saying and doing very aggressive things *feels* good for the individual "HEH ban all Mulsims kek" ,but only actively makes the situation worse - because the conclusion is impossible to implement. Israel cannot be removed and likely won't join some larger body of nation states that would sublate it any time soon, so the end goal of Hamas' program is foolish and impossible, generally speaking. I should also point out that Hamas has hardly ever engaged in any sort of attack abroad - they may do and say silly things in response to terror attacks abroad, but they're not concerned with attacking European states - the idea has come up a few times, but it's almost always shut down in pretty short order as I've been given to understand anyways.

This thread hurt my pp and make me xd LOL

?????????

Have you read the Quran or Hadiths? Who are you to tell these extreme Muslims that follow scripture so closely that they are just people looking for an excuse or don't understand their faith? People have shown time and time again in so many difference places on and off the internet how easy it is to understand ISIS members' mindsets when you actually read the scripture they hold so dearly. They quote it when they do so many awful things just as governments do in many many many Muslim majority countries and do you know why they do that? Because the scripture is abhorrent right after the start of the Quran and while you can cherry pick things that sound like sunshine and rainbows shined out of the ass of the Prophet Mohammed you can look at the rest and see and overwhelming majority of abhorrent disgusting shit that has absolutely no place in a civil society. Even the things that are nice are contradicted heavily later on.

The only way you can possibly think the way you do is if you haven't actually read the scripture yourself. Good job, you speak to a lot of Muslims. Do you realise you're very unlikely to meet the people that are carrying out these attacks and even if you did they'd never in a fucking million years let you know how disgusting their views actually are? Anecdotal evidence based on people you interact with from the Muslim community does not represent the whole of Islam as a people any more than ISIS does but you know what ISIS do represent? The fucking scripture.

Konr m8 you realise the Bible is also full of heinous, contradictory, warmongering, gay-hating, heathen-stoning backwards shit right? Yet you don't have religious Christian extremists committing these acts of terror today. What people are suggesting is that there are perhaps cultural, social, economic, historical and geopolitical factors at work here. Perhaps the reasons for this shit, and therefore the solutions to it, are slightly more nuanced than "Islam = bad, Quran = bad."

Like clockwork someone has to respond with whataboutism whenever someone criticises Islam. Yes, the Bible says some awful stuff as well but as you say yourself there aren't constant terror attacks being done by Christians right now and there has been a lot of reformation in their faith which means that most of them don't even take anything seriously in their scripture. There are also new and old testament in the Bible which some feel effectively sets a new precedence for how to act anyway, and nowhere in the Bible does it say it's unalterable or the direct word of God.

Of course there are many other factors are work here, but you cannot tell me that because of that the factor of the actual scripture/religion itself has sweet fuck all to do with it. It's not only a factor but the very thing that they use as reason for their actions. Whether it's only about the thing I mentioned or not, why do people like you have such a bad taste in your mouth after reading someone criticising the doctrine of Islam and pointing to clear motivation behind extremist actions without even needing to take scripture out of context but are completely okay with saying the same shit about Catholicism? Why is Islamophobia a thing on it's own while no other religion has anything of the sort? Why is it exempt from criticism?

I didn't say Islam is exempt from criticism. I don't have bad taste in my mouth from you criticising Islam. I didn't employ any whataboutism and I didn't mention Islamaphobia. Infact, as a bisexual atheist I have an extreme problem with a belief system that advocates beheading me or throwing me from rooftops because of who I am. But good job on knocking down that strawman you set up.

no one is arguing that religious fundamentalism, when under the right conditions, can lead to horrible acts of violence. we're simply disputing the idea that there's something inherent in Islam that makes it more violent than any other religion. I think the history of the world disproves the idea that circumstance + dogma can't lead to violence in a lot of different faiths.

and putting that aside, where does this argument over what % of the reason for terrorism is strictly religion and what % is geopolitical get us? shouldn't we be talking about what to do to prevent terrorism from happening? and two things we can do without harming any non-terrorist Muslims along the way are pretty obvious: 1) end the imperialist US/UK/etc. presence in the Middle East, and 2) stop giving money to the most radical Islamic terror state in the world. how are either of those things controversial?

and as for this point

every religion has people who hold a prejudice against it. ISIS, for instance, could be described as anti-semitic and anti-Christian. however, we live in the west, and extreme Islamophobia is more common here. When a white Christian neo-Nazi kills people, we don't tend to propose measures to crack down on the rights of other whites or other Christians or even other confirmed neo-Nazis. but because Muslims have been racialized (people don't tend to picture an Indonesian guy around these parts when they think of a Muslim) and otherized, lots of people are in favor of blanket bans as a solution to the problem.

it's not that Islam has nothing to do with these lunatics blowing themselves up, it's that the way we respond to these sorts of things is so fixed on religion above all else.

and on top of that, as one of the articles I posted earlier points out, this holy war rhetoric is a self-fulfilling prophecy. we went from groups like Hezbollah and al-Qaeda, who had specific geopolitical motives and whose faith permitted them to not think twice about horrible civilian atrocities to achieve those goals, to ISIS, who have said that they want to completely annihilate all non-believers regardless of our geopolitical actions. they are what we erroneously projected onto previous terrorist groups. I am extremely worried that, as might be the case with climate change, we have reached a point of no return in this religious conflict stuff. it was bad enough when you had dick cheney and donald rumsfeld on one side, and al-qaeda on the other, but it's a lot worse when it's steve bannon and steven miller vs ISIS.

It must be nice being this naive
Lets just conveniently ignore the statistics and the fact that islam isnt just a religion but also has its own law system and military guidelines

Its sad that they can just blow up kids at a concert and you people will still rush to their defense

.

I think it's important to be able to criticize religious doctrine or text without being labeled words such as "islamophobe". It's a retarded buzzword that has no real definition so it just groups people who criticize Islam, any group Muslims, or individual Muslims together as a way to suppress the legitimacy of their argument.

If your religious text/prophet literally tells people to convert/kill all non-Muslims I think it's okay to put some of the blame on it.

why the fuck are people still calling each other "cuck"