So, about 6-9 months ago I discovered 6s tf2. Before, I only played pubs and mainly played scout, with soldier and demo as my next two most played classes. I was really drawn to the demoman in 6s, though, so I decided to start practising with the class to get to a decent standard. I have about 1000 hours playtime at the time of this post.
I started by practising pipe aim on tr_walkway and tr_rocket_shooting and have put a lot of hours into that and I feel like I hit the vast majority of shots there. I found that MGE has helped me on scout (which I also practise a bit) but most people didn't want to play me as demo so I stopped practising there. I also started playing 6s lobbies on tf2center with mixed results.
I haven't had enough time to play many lobbies for the last few months so I've been mainly practising on DM servers and the training maps. The problem is, I feel I've really hit a wall with demoman. In DM servers, I get completely destroyed. Despite having put so much more time into demo, I perform much better as scout and even as soldier (who I haven't really practised with much outside of learning to do jump_beef) even in DM servers against much better players. I just can't seem to hit enough pipes in real game situations despite all my practise, it makes it very frustrating for me playing in a real game situation as I don't have the confidence to break out the pipes when I need them - I'm constantly getting killed by scouts in lobbies.
At this point, even though I still find demoman the most fun to play, I'm fighting the urge to just switch to playing scout or soldier where I seem to get much more success. If anybody has been through a similar thing or has any advice as to breaking past this phase, that'd be a great help.
So, about 6-9 months ago I discovered 6s tf2. Before, I only played pubs and mainly played scout, with soldier and demo as my next two most played classes. I was really drawn to the demoman in 6s, though, so I decided to start practising with the class to get to a decent standard. I have about 1000 hours playtime at the time of this post.
I started by practising pipe aim on tr_walkway and tr_rocket_shooting and have put a lot of hours into that and I feel like I hit the vast majority of shots there. I found that MGE has helped me on scout (which I also practise a bit) but most people didn't want to play me as demo so I stopped practising there. I also started playing 6s lobbies on tf2center with mixed results.
I haven't had enough time to play many lobbies for the last few months so I've been mainly practising on DM servers and the training maps. The problem is, I feel I've really hit a wall with demoman. In DM servers, I get completely destroyed. Despite having put so much more time into demo, I perform much better as scout and even as soldier (who I haven't really practised with much outside of learning to do jump_beef) even in DM servers against much better players. I just can't seem to hit enough pipes in real game situations despite all my practise, it makes it very frustrating for me playing in a real game situation as I don't have the confidence to break out the pipes when I need them - I'm constantly getting killed by scouts in lobbies.
At this point, even though I still find demoman the most fun to play, I'm fighting the urge to just switch to playing scout or soldier where I seem to get much more success. If anybody has been through a similar thing or has any advice as to breaking past this phase, that'd be a great help.
You should first go to mixchamp, as pugchamp wouldnt be a good place to go at the skill level (im at the same one, although im a soldier) and also try 6s and then do like ugc silver or something and possibly play highlander
You should first go to mixchamp, as pugchamp wouldnt be a good place to go at the skill level (im at the same one, although im a soldier) and also try 6s and then do like ugc silver or something and possibly play highlander
JozhoggI just can't seem to hit enough pipes in real game situations despite all my practise, it makes it very frustrating for me playing in a real game situation as I don't have the confidence to break out the pipes when I need them - I'm constantly getting killed by scouts in lobbies.
Are you solely relying on pipes? Stickies are your primary, and you should not be forced to hit clutch 2pipes all the time otherwise you have bad positioning. You shouldn't be ahead of your team, you should be behind someone and have traps/protective sticks up. I'm not good at demo but those are my 2 cents.
[quote=Jozhogg]I just can't seem to hit enough pipes in real game situations despite all my practise, it makes it very frustrating for me playing in a real game situation as I don't have the confidence to break out the pipes when I need them - I'm constantly getting killed by scouts in lobbies.[/quote]
Are you solely relying on pipes? Stickies are your primary, and you should not be forced to hit clutch 2pipes all the time otherwise you have bad positioning. You shouldn't be ahead of your team, you should be behind someone and have traps/protective sticks up. I'm not good at demo but those are my 2 cents.
I use my stickies 90% of the time, I feel like my positioning is "ok" but it's so difficult in lobbies as the structure and coordination of the team is very hard to follow.
I use my stickies 90% of the time, I feel like my positioning is "ok" but it's so difficult in lobbies as the structure and coordination of the team is very hard to follow.
Over time you will become better. If you feel like you aren't making any progress, watch POV's of other demos, how they play, what they do and such.
the reason you feel that you want to switch to another class could be that you find yourself often in 1v1 situations and that is something a demo really shouldn't get into. And since demo is such a versatile class you need improve on a lot of different aspects.
TLDR play the game more and watch other demomen
Over time you will become better. If you feel like you aren't making any progress, watch POV's of other demos, how they play, what they do and such.
the reason you feel that you want to switch to another class could be that you find yourself often in 1v1 situations and that is something a demo really shouldn't get into. And since demo is such a versatile class you need improve on a lot of different aspects.
TLDR play the game more and watch other demomen
JozhoggI use my stickies 90% of the time, I feel like my positioning is "ok" but it's so difficult in lobbies as the structure and coordination of the team is very hard to follow.
I agree, theres not a lot of coordination in lobbies (not at all tbh), try mixchamps although to my knowledge EU mixchamps arent that active at all, at least not as active as NA mixchamps
[quote=Jozhogg]I use my stickies 90% of the time, I feel like my positioning is "ok" but it's so difficult in lobbies as the structure and coordination of the team is very hard to follow.[/quote]
I agree, theres not a lot of coordination in lobbies (not at all tbh), try mixchamps although to my knowledge EU mixchamps arent that active at all, at least not as active as NA mixchamps
Demo is mostly a team and teamwork oriented class so if you're playing low level pugs and lobbies you're going to be getting wrecked by scouts and soldier all the time if you aren't deliberately working behind your team and they aren't actively trying to help you. That said there's always more you can do individually, whether that's through practicing more dm (which you may dread), or just saying to yourself "how can I play in any given situation to not die almost-ever while still contributing something to the fights and holds". So you could play nice and far back and with a huge emphasis on keeping yourself safe. It won't be as beneficial to your team but if they're not working around you at all then it might actually be better that just dying all the time. With more experience you'll be able to predict the future (which is often pretty predictable in this game) and demo is the best class to play if you can do that since, if you have enough time, you can literally place bombs where you know people will go and wait to "frag" with your mouse2.
Demo is mostly a team and teamwork oriented class so if you're playing low level pugs and lobbies you're going to be getting wrecked by scouts and soldier all the time if you aren't deliberately working behind your team and they aren't actively trying to help you. That said there's always more you can do individually, whether that's through practicing more dm (which you may dread), or just saying to yourself "how can I play in any given situation to not die almost-ever while still contributing something to the fights and holds". So you could play nice and far back and with a huge emphasis on keeping yourself safe. It won't be as beneficial to your team but if they're not working around you at all then it might actually be better that just dying all the time. With more experience you'll be able to predict the future (which is often pretty predictable in this game) and demo is the best class to play if you can do that since, if you have enough time, you can literally place bombs where you know people will go and wait to "frag" with your mouse2.
I have no 6s demo experience, but one thing I remember b4nny saying on stream stuck out to me. Somebody asked "what should my mindset be while playing demoman?" and he replied something along the lines of "Always think 'Who is going to try to kill me, and how can I stop them?' "
Based on what you said your hours are, you started playing competitive fairly early in your TF2 career. You will keep getting better- compare yourself to when you first started playing. I'm sure the improvement has been monumental, and it's something you should be proud of, really!
Don't judge yourself based on whether you're winning straight up DM duels against players on tf2center. In general, I've found they tend to be pretty disorganized, and have players with relatively strong DM who do random shit cause it's "just a lobby". There's no shame in missing pipes against a scout with 5 times your experience in competitive TF2. Just keep playing, and you'll keep getting better like you already have been :) also try to find a team to improve and work with, it will make the world of difference to your overall play.
I have no 6s demo experience, but one thing I remember b4nny saying on stream stuck out to me. Somebody asked "what should my mindset be while playing demoman?" and he replied something along the lines of "Always think 'Who is going to try to kill me, and how can I stop them?' "
Based on what you said your hours are, you started playing competitive fairly early in your TF2 career. You will keep getting better- compare yourself to when you first started playing. I'm sure the improvement has been monumental, and it's something you should be proud of, really!
Don't judge yourself based on whether you're winning straight up DM duels against players on tf2center. In general, I've found they tend to be pretty disorganized, and have players with relatively strong DM who do random shit cause it's "just a lobby". There's no shame in missing pipes against a scout with 5 times your experience in competitive TF2. Just keep playing, and you'll keep getting better like you already have been :) also try to find a team to improve and work with, it will make the world of difference to your overall play.
pugs and lobbies will force you into retarded situations where you have to rely on dm to get out of them, it will occasionally be handy, but 2 things that make demos stand out are calls and mids, organizing a team around your damage is more efficient than letting a medic try and call focus targets, and demos who know who to focus and what areas to deny on mids can win mids for their team.
pugs and lobbies will force you into retarded situations where you have to rely on dm to get out of them, it will occasionally be handy, but 2 things that make demos stand out are calls and mids, organizing a team around your damage is more efficient than letting a medic try and call focus targets, and demos who know who to focus and what areas to deny on mids can win mids for their team.
Agree with everyone that's said MixChamp. After I found I had definitely moved on from TF2C's skill ceiling I dipped my feet into PugChamp and MixChamp. MixChamp is a bit more casual and the general skill level is not as high as PugChamp, but it can be hard to compete on PugChamp because the skill levels are so varied. They can range anywhere from about where you are to literally relatively high invite pugs because of the players that frequent the site. That said MixChamp is a more relaxed alternative with a much higher skill ceiling than lobbies, where players will most likely be focused on helping keep you alive and not letting you get +forwarded like in lobbies.
Agree with everyone that's said MixChamp. After I found I had definitely moved on from TF2C's skill ceiling I dipped my feet into PugChamp and MixChamp. MixChamp is a bit more casual and the general skill level is not as high as PugChamp, but it can be hard to compete on PugChamp because the skill levels are so varied. They can range anywhere from about where you are to literally relatively high invite pugs because of the players that frequent the site. That said MixChamp is a more relaxed alternative with a much higher skill ceiling than lobbies, where players will most likely be focused on helping keep you alive and not letting you get +forwarded like in lobbies.
position yourself so you don't die when key members of your team are down (medic, stronger scout, etc..)
position yourself so you don't die when key members of your team are down (medic, stronger scout, etc..)